Leupold CDS Turrets......

[trophy8]

For those of you who recommend learning your ballistics table backward and forward and tailoring adjustments to your specific environment and making adjustments with a standard knob, would your answer change if the shooter used one load and was only interested in stretching his/her effective range to 400-500 yards for hunting purposes?

I know that you can achieve more precision at long range by being very skilled and experienced at determining your scope adjustment and making said adjustment. I just question whether it's really necessary if you are hunting at intermediate ranges rather than attempting to cut the X at 1,000 yards. Personally, I'd like to extend my effective range to 400-500 yards, but I don't have much interest in shooting beyond that. I've run some calculations, and it doesn't appear that environmentals (aside from wind) make a very big difference at those ranges. My plan was to put a CDS dial on my nest rifle. Would I be better suited by doing otherwise given my intended purposes?

If you’re only shooting targets then it’s not a big deal. If you’re gonna shoot at animals then I’d tell you it’s very irresponsible to not learn it. You’d be surprised how much difference it makes. What did you change? Just elevation?

[Quackerbox]

Opened the box of mine today. Being my first gold ring in roughly 15 years all I can say is WOW.

The HD glass is amazing. Even the turret operation vs. The latest Nikon in same price range is night and day.

I might have to think about cutting loose vari x3 on my 7mm

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[Shane]

For those of you who recommend learning your ballistics table backward and forward and tailoring adjustments to your specific environment and making adjustments with a standard knob, would your answer change if the shooter used one load and was only interested in stretching his/her effective range to 400-500 yards for hunting purposes?

I know that you can achieve more precision at long range by being very skilled and experienced at determining your scope adjustment and making said adjustment. I just question whether it's really necessary if you are hunting at intermediate ranges rather than attempting to cut the X at 1,000 yards. Personally, I'd like to extend my effective range to 400-500 yards, but I don't have much interest in shooting beyond that. I've run some calculations, and it doesn't appear that environmentals (aside from wind) make a very big difference at those ranges. My plan was to put a CDS dial on my nest rifle. Would I be better suited by doing otherwise given my intended purposes?

I use Strelok Pro app so I don't have to memorize ballistic tables. One thing that I learned a few years ago on a mule deer hunt was temperature MATTERS. I had my data all put into the app (just like I would do if I were ordering a custom turret). I had done my sighting in during the summer. Then when I was hunting mule deer in the Panhandle in November on a cold 20 degree morning, I had a 400 yard shot at a buck. I shot him....6 times before he finally went down. When I got to him, you could almost see daylight and stick your arm through the hole in his upper front leg and brisket. I had a really nice group, but it was about 4" lower than I thought I was aiming. I didn't change the temperature setting on my app. A couple months later, I was reading a thread on here and a comment about temps. I went to my app and put everything back in the way I had it for the shot on that buck and then I changed the temp to 20 degrees. Bingo! It told me to aim 4" higher at 20 degrees for that 400 yard shot with my 7mag.

A custom turret based on warmer temp data would have been just as off as my app was when I didn't adjust it for air temp.

[bearintex]

This is the same boat I’m in. I just want to extend my range. I’m never going to be a “long” range shooter.

Also for you guys that have the dial and use factory ammo, do you use the factory specs from the box? Right now I use the Hornady 140 gr bthp. It will put four shots touching. However I still think I need to chrono my gun as I am shooting it suppressed.

Hornady Black 140 bthp run 2645 avg through my gun. Box velocity is 2730 iirc. Drop at 600 works out to ~85” at box velocity. At 2645, it is about 91”. Easily enough to cause a miss on a deer or pig.

[bowaddict40]

Hornady Black 140 bthp run 2645 avg through my gun. Box velocity is 2730 iirc. Drop at 600 works out to ~85” at box velocity. At 2645, it is about 91”. Easily enough to cause a miss on a deer or pig.

Thank you very much. That’s the kind of info I need. Now I just need to find someone in dallas that has a chrono.


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[bearintex]

Thank you very much. That’s the kind of info I need. Now I just need to find someone in dallas that has a chrono.


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https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1015050210/caldwell-ballistic-precision-chronograph

Well worth the investment if you shoot much at all.

[bowaddict40]

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/10...on-chronograph



Well worth the investment if you shoot much at all.

Problem is I really don’t. I shoot enough to make sure my gun is still good and hunt.


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[THE UNDERTAKER]

Go for it . I have one on a leupold vxr 4x12x40 firedot on Ar15 and one on vx6 3x18x50 fine duplex on savage 10 308 and I wouldn’t have it any other way. Took two does this year at good distance . One at 662 yards and one at 709 yards . Really easy to use but like anything need to practice and know your wind. And like everyone else has said , you are stuck to one load . As I do hand load It took awhile to find a load that shoots true in both cool and warmer temps . But if you do change loads you can always order another dial .Just my opinion but good luck with ur decision.

[Slow&Steady]

If you’re only shooting targets then it’s not a big deal. If you’re gonna shoot at animals then I’d tell you it’s very irresponsible to not learn it. You’d be surprised how much difference it makes. What did you change? Just elevation?

Elevation, temperature, and humidity.

Here's an example of my observation using Hornady's online ballistic calculator.

Condition 1
Elevation: 500 ft
Temperature: 65 degrees
Humidity: 70%
Sight Height 1.5 in
Round: 308WIN Hornady 168gr BTHP @ 2700fps
MOA Adjustment at 500 Yards: 11.12

Condition 2
Elevation: 10,000 ft
Temperature: 30 degrees
Humidity: 30%
Sight Height 1.5 in
Round: 308WIN Hornady 168gr BTHP @ 2700fps
MOA Adjustment at 500 Yards: 11.35

This is a functional difference of 1/4 MOA or one click at 500 yards. This will represent approximately a 1.25 inch difference on target at that range. When you are aiming at a 10"X10" space behind the shoulder of a deer sized game animal (much larger for elk, 1.25" isn't a deal breaker. My view is that I can turn the CDS dial to the appropriate range and take the shot in much less time and with much less potential for error than I would if I had to refer to a table before taking the shot. I'm not saying that using tables isn't more precise than the CDS (in fact I would use tables if shooting longer than 500 for sure). I'm simply questioning whether using tables is necessary or efficient at intermediate ranges when, by all accounts I have read, the CDS system is dead nuts if you have good data, and environmentals don't make more than 2" of difference at those ranges.

[Slow&Steady]

Thank you very much. That’s the kind of info I need. Now I just need to find someone in dallas that has a chrono.


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Call B Tactical in Caddo Mills. They have a great range and I think they may rent chronos.

[Stick1]

Elevation, temperature, and humidity.

Here's an example of my observation using Hornady's online ballistic calculator.

Condition 1
Elevation: 500 ft
Temperature: 65 degrees
Humidity: 70%
Sight Height 1.5 in
Round: 308WIN Hornady 168gr BTHP @ 2700fps
MOA Adjustment at 500 Yards: 11.12

Condition 2
Elevation: 10,000 ft
Temperature: 30 degrees
Humidity: 30%
Sight Height 1.5 in
Round: 308WIN Hornady 168gr BTHP @ 2700fps
MOA Adjustment at 500 Yards: 11.35

This is a functional difference of 1/4 MOA or one click at 500 yards. This will represent approximately a 1.25 inch difference on target at that range. When you are aiming at a 10"X10" space behind the shoulder of a deer sized game animal (much larger for elk, 1.25" isn't a deal breaker. My view is that I can turn the CDS dial to the appropriate range and take the shot in much less time and with much less potential for error than I would if I had to refer to a table before taking the shot. I'm not saying that using tables isn't more precise than the CDS (in fact I would use tables if shooting longer than 500 for sure). I'm simply questioning whether using tables is necessary or efficient at intermediate ranges when, by all accounts I have read, the CDS system is dead nuts if you have good data, and environmentals don't make more than 2" of difference at those ranges.

Where is pressure in your calculations? Its a much bigger factor than humidity.

[Slow&Steady]

Same conditions as above.

Condition 1
MOA adjustment at 500 yards (Barometric Pressure at 29): +10.97
MOA adjustment at 500 yards (Barometric Pressure at 30.5): +11.17

Condition 2
MOA adjustment at 500 yards (Barometric Pressure at 29): +11.22
MOA adjustment at 500 yards (Barometric Pressure at 30.5): +11.44

This is a pretty wide range of conditions, including an elevation change of 9,500, feet, a temperature difference of 40 degrees, a humidity difference of 40%, and a barometric pressure difference of 1.5 inches. At the extreme end, the data I have used shows a 3 inch difference at most. If I were to order a CDS dial, I would either order one for each set of conditions (representing hunting here in Texas, as well as at high altitude), or possibly order a single turret that splits the two. If you split the middle, you are still only off by 1.5 inches at 500 yards at either conditional extreme.

[trophy8]

Same conditions as above.

Condition 1
MOA adjustment at 500 yards (Barometric Pressure at 29): +10.97
MOA adjustment at 500 yards (Barometric Pressure at 30.5): +11.17

Condition 2
MOA adjustment at 500 yards (Barometric Pressure at 29): +11.22
MOA adjustment at 500 yards (Barometric Pressure at 30.5): +11.44

This is a pretty wide range of conditions, including an elevation change of 9,500, feet, a temperature difference of 40 degrees, a humidity difference of 40%, and a barometric pressure difference of 1.5 inches. At the extreme end, the data I have used shows a 3 inch difference at most. If I were to order a CDS dial, I would either order one for each set of conditions (representing hunting here in Texas, as well as at high altitude), or possibly order a single turret that splits the two. If you split the middle, you are still only off by 1.5 inches at 500 yards at either conditional extreme.

Lmao. Pressure change is FAR greater than that. Very low at high altitude. I was at 21-22ish at 8000’ if I recall.



I know you’re looking at what your data says. Try shooting in it. And it’s just beginning at 500. Go to 1000 or better.

[Slow&Steady]

I understand it makes a big difference at 1,000 yards. I have no intention or desire to shoot that far. I've shot out to 1,000 with my brother and it's fun on the range, but doesn't appeal to me for hunting purposes. Therefore, I'm not concerned with ranges beyond 500. Also, I've attached a list of record atmospheric pressures below. Further, I looked at the records for Leadville, CO, which is above 10,000 ft, and did not find a pressure record below 29in. I believe the only time you will find pressures below 28 or so is in a major storm.

https://www.wunderground.com/resourc...re_records.asp

Again, if my purpose was to shoot out beyond that, I would fit my rifle with a dedicated long range optic. I don't question that that is the better answer for those purposes. I'm more concerned with whether or not the CDS system provides accurate adjustments that can be relied on from 300 yards to 500 yards.

[trophy8]

I understand it makes a big difference at 1,000 yards. I have no intention or desire to shoot that far. I've shot out to 1,000 with my brother and it's fun on the range, but doesn't appeal to me for hunting purposes. Therefore, I'm not concerned with ranges beyond 500. Also, I've attached a list of record atmospheric pressures below. Further, I looked at the records for Leadville, CO, which is above 10,000 ft, and did not find a pressure record below 29in. I believe the only time you will find pressures below 28 or so is in a major storm.

https://www.wunderground.com/resourc...re_records.asp

Again, if my purpose was to shoot out beyond that, I would fit my rifle with a dedicated long range optic. I don't question that that is the better answer for those purposes. I'm more concerned with whether or not the CDS system provides accurate adjustments that can be relied on from 300 yards to 500 yards.

My kestrel says otherwise. In person.