HF farm animals, cheesey Africa hunts and Nick Nolte

[breederbuck33]

I'm not going to take the time to read all the posts here. I don't know who Rinella is nor do his opinions effect what I do. I do have current experience managing both High fenced and low fenced properties and will speak from my personal experience. I have no personal experience with kick and shoot operations thus offer no comment. Not my thing.

Having both high fenced and low fenced pastures literally side by side,I see no difference in deer behavior or hunt ability . The primary difference I see between the 2 pastures is the fenced pasture provides the OPPORTUNITY to allow bucks to age. Hunter decisions decide if that actually happens; same as low fence.Fences don't grow big deer. It's what is done inside the fence that determines results. My qualifier is that both pastures are plenty large enough to allow normal deer movement and behavior.

Actually the wildest, hardest deer to hunt are on my farm in La. which is part of a 2500 acre game fenced property. For anyone that thinks hunting wild whitetail deer inside a 2500 acre enclosure in La. is a canned hunt I make this offer:

I'll show you pics of a mature [ 6+ yr old } buck that we have determined we want to chase. I'll give you the season to chase him.If you get him you will have a terrific trophy. If you are unsuccessful you have to pay all my expenses...feed, seed, labor...that it takes to try and grow these deer. Good luck.

One more caveat . Success or failure it will be required to wright a full story on the challenge of the hunt.

I'd love to see someone take on this challenge... I hunted 4 years on a 2400 acre HF ranch in Webb county. We hunted one particular deer for 3 years and only saw him twice in person... lots of hunters and non-hunters assume HF means kick and shoot and that is just ignorant. As far as this topic is concerned... I couldn't care less how someone chooses to hunt.. A trophy is what you make it, if your happy I'm happy for you! May not be my thing but I'm glad you enjoyed it! I also agree that if a majority of the anti-HF hunters were invited to a quality ranch to hunt they'd change their mindset.

[CrookedArrow]

Have you just now discovered Rinella? His books and podcasts are classic. You'll learn a lot from the guy.

I actually like the guy. I agree with him on stuff... and disagree with him on plenty of other stuff. He is a raised poacher, conservationist, moderate, writer, and has opinions on just about everything that will make you laugh, nod, and/or shake your head.

He has been around for quite some time. Well spoken, not afraid to speak his mind. Like a lot of people I know. And just like a lot of people I know... I don't always agree with them on several topics of debate... but that doesn't stop me from listening to them or associating with them... or for real-life folks... being their friends.

More like in the last 3-4 yrs. I have just started listening to his podcasts. I have burned through just about every Meat Eater show.

I am now reading his American Bison book. I also has 4 other of his books. I will say the dude is very well educated and has a ton of knowledge. He is a on hands kinda guy, imo.

This is not a loyalty deal to him on my part. Some of his stuff I think he is spot on, other agendas not so much. He is in a different part of the world where he does most his hunts. It may vary different from the way we hunt Texas.

If you must know why I went with the topic at hand look at most of the above threads. It's division of sorts of what we consider to be hunters. The topics mentioned can cause a bar room brawl amongst us.

Every single person will have a varying opinion. Do I like HF deer? Not my cup of tea. I would take greater pride in taking a 140 LF buck I have watched mature for 5 yrs. Some of you from this forum may have hunted with me on a LF/ HF ranch several yrs ago I oufitted on. So before the name calling comes out think back a bit and tell me I am breaking windows on glass houses.

Africa has its rifts and rafts. There are some very good hunts just as mentioned some very bad pen hunts. Hunts can be bad or good anywhere. These hunts I have never done nor do I intend to.

I can further split hairs and really pizz people off when I say I don't consider Thompson Temple a legit hunt for bow and worse for rifle hunters. I have been there done that so before you jump on the wagon "you never been, you don't know what your effin talking about!" Not my deal.

Fact. If you enjoy and your within legal means, knock yourself out. I merely opened with I agree with what Steve had to say in the podcsst. Which I do.

I am old, fat, crippled and hunt from box and bow blinds. I have adapted to what I can and can not do. I absolutely love, eat, breath hunting. We can talk for hours about hunts etc. Steve would not be to keen on my style of so called hunting.

Steve scales Mount Everest to kill goats etc. His physical ability leaves me in the dirt. Then again he would more then likely leave quite a few behind.

Steve is imo a great advocate for hunters and people who enjoy the outdoors. He is a little rough around the edges to some but that's ok arn't we all???

There are a ton of hunting shows out there. His is one of the better ones. It's not about scoring the horns it is more about yielding plates of meat.

There is no right or wrong answer but dozens of varying opinions as noted from the topic starter to where it ends

[Bleu]

I will admit I’m not a Rinella groupie and don’t track his exploits, however, the point I’m trying to make is that there are levels to this and it’s all relative to perspective. We all do the same thing. If I grew up hunting in the mountains, that how I would hunt. Being from Texas, I hunt fragmented property that won’t allow for his style of hunting. So we do the best we can to bring them to us. I struggle to understand why someone would look down on how someone else hunts/kills or what ever you want to call it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I guess I am a Rinella groupie, and you're right, there are certainly levels and varying perspectives. If by "we all do the same thing", you mean we all end up at the same result (dead animal), then I can see the point your making. I also certainly understand where you're coming from on hunting the way you know, or are able to. Practically everyone east of the 100th meridian has to scratch and claw through fragmented private land to do just that.

All that said, and to stay on the original topic, I never get the sense he's looking down on anyone. I feel like he likes to wrestle with ideas and keep an open mind. That's what draws me to his writing and tv/audio. His current stance seems to be do whatever you want, but don't hide it. Show the fence, show the ear tag, show the feeder, etc. but please don't call it hunting.

[muzzyslinger]

Wow, this got out of hand quick.

Its just kids being kids--

[Radar]

I guess I am a Rinella groupie, and you're right, there are certainly levels and varying perspectives. If by "we all do the same thing", you mean we all end up at the same result (dead animal), then I can see the point your making. I also certainly understand where you're coming from on hunting the way you know, or are able to. Practically everyone east of the 100th meridian has to scratch and claw through fragmented private land to do just that.

All that said, and to stay on the original topic, I never get the sense he's looking down on anyone. I feel like he likes to wrestle with ideas and keep an open mind. That's what draws me to his writing and tv/audio. His current stance seems to be do whatever you want, but don't hide it. Show the fence, show the ear tag, show the feeder, etc. but please don't call it hunting.

That could mean that if we hunt low fence using a feeder or food plots, we are not hunting.

[Stoof]

I’m actually enjoying this conversation and feel like it has remained pretty civil for the internet. Rinella and Newberg are the most down to earth guys in the so called industry. I’ve learned to love the box blind as much as I crave getting up over ten thousand feet and sleeping on the ground. We can have it both ways and call it whatever we want. Going out west and hitting public land keeps me motivated to stay in shape. And watching juniper grow next to a feeder gives me time to reflect. And in both endeavors hopefully I get meat in the freezer.


-------------------------------
Violence never settles anything
-Genghis Kahn

[Kdog]

I'm not going to take the time to read all the posts here. I don't know who Rinella is nor do his opinions effect what I do. I do have current experience managing both High fenced and low fenced properties and will speak from my personal experience. I have no personal experience with kick and shoot operations thus offer no comment. Not my thing.

Having both high fenced and low fenced pastures literally side by side,I see no difference in deer behavior or hunt ability . The primary difference I see between the 2 pastures is the fenced pasture provides the OPPORTUNITY to allow bucks to age. Hunter decisions decide if that actually happens; same as low fence.Fences don't grow big deer. It's what is done inside the fence that determines results. My qualifier is that both pastures are plenty large enough to allow normal deer movement and behavior.

Actually the wildest, hardest deer to hunt are on my farm in La. which is part of a 2500 acre game fenced property. For anyone that thinks hunting wild whitetail deer inside a 2500 acre enclosure in La. is a canned hunt I make this offer:

I'll show you pics of a mature [ 6+ yr old } buck that we have determined we want to chase. I'll give you the season to chase him.If you get him you will have a terrific trophy. If you are unsuccessful you have to pay all my expenses...feed, seed, labor...that it takes to try and grow these deer. Good luck.

One more caveat . Success or failure it will be required to wright a full story on the challenge of the hunt.

If I find myself wealthy and retired I may take you up on that challenge! I need the run of the property for 12 months (you know for scouting) and we will need to agree on what your expenses are up front. Also wondering if that means I have exclusive hunting rights?

[Kdog]

The argument against high fenced hunting or breeder bucks shouldn't be that it is an unfair measuring stick, that is childish. (hello RiverRat1!) It should be that it is bad for habitat and hunting in general. That is the only argument against it that make sense to me. It may be bad it may not, I don't know.

[Sideler]

Hi fence, low fence, I don't care. What I do care about is anything that makes motor boating easier.

[rocky]

The argument against high fenced hunting or breeder bucks shouldn't be that it is an unfair measuring stick, that is childish. (hello RiverRat1!) It should be that it is bad for habitat and hunting in general. That is the only argument against it that make sense to me. It may be bad it may not, I don't know.

Every generation wants it to be better/easier for the next.
Every hunter deserves a 200" deer, right?
At some point, Texas hunting will predominantly be MLD, and/or high fence.
Small landowners like myself, will be forced to conglomerate with other small landowners to become part of an MLD, and restricted to killing what biologist deem appropriate.
The State of Texas is simply turning Whitetail Deer into livestock.
Deer hunting in Texas will eventually become a "pay to play" endeavor,( If it's not already at this point), and it is slowly creeping northward to OK and KS.

[chancito1]

Let’s be honest, you have to actually hunt on a 5k acre hf ranch, not so much on a 300 acre

[Peyton]

http://discussions.texasbowhunter.co...d.php?t=676908

[RiverRat1]

The argument against high fenced hunting or breeder bucks shouldn't be that it is an unfair measuring stick, that is childish. (hello RiverRat1!) It should be that it is bad for habitat and hunting in general. That is the only argument against it that make sense to me. It may be bad it may not, I don't know.

I believe I did explain how it was bad for hunting in general.

And I never argued HF hunting was bad. I don't like kick and shoot places but to each their own.

[popup_menace]

This debate is much more intricate than a simple “for or against” discussion. Between landowner rights, wildlife ownership, population statistics, disease statistics, and perception by the non-hunters, it is very possible that no real agreements will be made. Being born and raised in Tx has taught me how tough it can be to hunt animals even with a feeder. But, it has also shown me how easily animals in a high fence can be to spot and stalk when they are used to being fed out of a pickup.

Personally, I feel more accomplished seeing deer on a place with no fence than I do seeing anything on a small-ish HF place. That animal has little to no chance to leave, and that means that sooner or later persistence will pay off. There is not a guarantee that you will kill, but the odds are much more stacked in your favor. However, a 10,000 acre place with a HF around it is so large some deer will never travel the entire ranch. The fence isn’t the only factor, as the size of the enclosure determines how docile the animal is likely to become.

Perhaps I’m simple, but hunting an animal that has an abundance of choices on where it can go to evade me makes me feel like I lose a level of assurance while hunting. That assurance is what separates hunting from harvesting in my mind.

The bigger debates as to whether or not hunting is allowed whatsoever are coming, and they will be much more straightforward and pointed than this one. Hopefully we don’t allow the entire pursuit to dwindle on account of semantics.

[Kdog]

I believe I did explain how it was bad for hunting in general.

And I never argued HF hunting was bad. I don't like kick and shoot places but to each their own.

Yes, I think I may be talking in circles. Can't control or change anything about it anyway, not sure what I would do even if I could.

It is interesting, sometimes when you talk to out of state hunters they think the entire state of Texas is "Fenced."