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Old 07-11-2018, 10:43 AM   #1
RJH1
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Default Asa allowing stringwalking

Asa is starting bare bow class next year for all of you string walkers. 30 yard max. Idk if it is known distance and I figure compounders will be shooting too. If you want the class to last, go shoot it
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Old 07-11-2018, 11:21 AM   #2
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I never understood why things like this are not legal in 3D??? It not like they are adding a sight bar on their bow. To me, it's just a smarter indian thing! Same with the bow restrictions at the Texas State Longbow Championship. I understand it is their shoot, so they can have whatever rules they want. I won't miss the longbow shoot because it is such a great venue and format, so I use a different bow than normal and play by their rules!

IBO has a trad class that allows string walking/crawl, but IBO is nearly dead in Texas.

ASA is not as appealing to most trad folks because they only have one trad class, and last time I shot it, it was a 25yd max where the womens compound class shot the same stake. IMHO, you will never make both of those groups happy if they are both shooting from the same stake, and the ASA is always going to try to please the compounders first, as that is their bread and butter.

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Old 07-11-2018, 12:00 PM   #3
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Right on Bisch ! Exactly.

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Old 07-11-2018, 12:06 PM   #4
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Women compound an trad don't shoot from the same stake in asa
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Old 07-11-2018, 01:22 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RJH1 View Post
Women compound an trad don't shoot from the same stake in asa
They used to! So, does trad shooters have their own stake now?

EDIT: I just looked it up, and trad does not shoot with the women anymore. We get to shoot with the Elementary School Open Boys!!! That is an improvement. When I shot ASA, all the shots were between 20-25yds on almost every course I shot. As such, it was kind of boring. I hope they mix up the shots a little more these days to make a course more interesting.

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Old 07-11-2018, 01:27 PM   #6
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Calling Rick Barbee!

Go get 'em, buddy!
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Old 07-11-2018, 01:46 PM   #7
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Calling Rick Barbee!

Go get 'em, buddy!
If they are going to allow compound as barebow in the class, it will wind up being the same huge debacle as it is in other venues who do.
If that's the case, I'll pass.

If however, it will be stickbows only, then I might have to give it a serious looksee.

I don't mind gap shooting.

I'm kind of an outsider/in a class of my own anyway.
I shoot using non sighted target shooting methods (several),
but I do it all with my heavy draw hunting rigs.
I've never shot any bow other than my go to hunting rig in any competition, and don't plan on changing any time soon.
You won't/don't find many who reside in that catagory.

Rick
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Old 07-11-2018, 01:57 PM   #8
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Bisch, asa is still a lot of 20ish yard shots, and I heard people complain about them being too long...

Rick, I would be willing to bet that compounds will be included in the class. To set up a new class dedicated to equipment that has the least turnout currently seems highly unlikely,but I could be wrong

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Old 07-11-2018, 02:27 PM   #9
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Bisch, asa is still a lot of 20ish yard shots, and I heard people complain about them being too long...
I was not complaining at all! I just said it was boring having 30 of the same shots. And yes, there are a lot of guys who shoot trad who nearly never shoot much over 20yds, and as such, a course with all 20 yd shots would seem long to them.

Let's face it, ASA is a compound oriented organization. I don't have anything against that either, as the wheel guys and gals have to have a place to go have fun too. Even though they have a trad class, they are not geared toward the traditional shooter. That's why TBoT thrives the way it does; because it is focused on pleasing the trad shooters! There are way fewer trad shooters than wheel bow shooters out here, so we will never have as good of a turnout (esp at smaller shoots) as the wheel bow shoots do.

Just my 2 cents worth!

Bisch
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Old 07-11-2018, 02:29 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RJH1 View Post
Rick, I would be willing to bet that compounds will be included in the class. To set up a new class dedicated to equipment that has the least turnout currently seems highly unlikely,but I could be wrong
Oh, I know. Not worried about it.

Like I said, I'm kind of in my own category, and I like it that way. The only competition I have to worry about is myself, and my quarry.

No fuss, no muss.

Rick
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Old 07-11-2018, 02:44 PM   #11
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I've never understood having a different bow to compete vs hunt. Unless they are the exact same set up it would work that way for me I guess. Then why have 2?

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Old 07-11-2018, 03:08 PM   #12
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I've never understood having a different bow to compete vs hunt. Unless they are the exact same set up it would work that way for me I guess. Then why have 2?

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Probably like having a race car and a daily driver, while interchangeable, one is better suited to a particular task than the other
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Old 07-11-2018, 03:28 PM   #13
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I've never understood having a different bow to compete vs hunt. Unless they are the exact same set up it would work that way for me I guess. Then why have 2?

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I understand why some do.

My thing is - competition for me has always been about being a better shot for hunting, so I use the bow I hunt with.

Rick
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Old 07-11-2018, 03:34 PM   #14
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Bisch, I didn't think you were complaining, just happened to hear some people
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Old 07-11-2018, 03:38 PM   #15
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Saw a little more and it does look to be a non wheelie class after all
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Old 07-11-2018, 05:09 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RJH1 View Post
Saw a little more and it does look to be a non wheelie class after all


Well, if thatís the case, it will give all the guys shooting a fixed crawl and regular string walkers a place to go play!!!!

Bisch


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Old 07-11-2018, 06:07 PM   #17
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I would love to see a traditional "Dangerous Game Hunter" class.

Rick
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Old 07-11-2018, 06:09 PM   #18
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I would love to see a traditional "Dangerous Game Hunter" class.

Rick
Yessir!
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Old 07-11-2018, 06:35 PM   #19
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I wish ASA would separate the trad classes, you almost have to shoot a bow with a stabilizer and Aluminium riser to be competitive.They should put the compound classes together and how many participants they get so they can understand. IBO separates the classes, TBOT separates the classes. The string walk class is ok especially for them by knowing how far it is so they can walk it. I probably would not shoot it unless it was unknown distance. I also think they should stretch out the shots out to 30.
ASA is a good organization I just wish they would concentrate on the trade shooter a little more.
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Old 07-11-2018, 07:19 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by RickBarbee View Post
I understand why some do.

My thing is - competition for me has always been about being a better shot for hunting, so I use the bow I hunt with.

Rick
Exactly.

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Old 07-12-2018, 01:10 PM   #21
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Pardon my ignorance... What exactly defines barebow?

I speculate that it means no stabilizers, no rests, off the shelf only, no sights, finger release only, etc...as it implies...just stick and string? Im curious how thatd work with compound too.

How did it exclude string walking before?
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:29 PM   #22
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Pardon my ignorance... What exactly defines barebow?

I speculate that it means no stabilizers, no rests, off the shelf only, no sights, finger release only, etc...as it implies...just stick and string? Im curious how thatd work with compound too.

How did it exclude string walking before?
It depends - governing organizations (FITA, IFAA, NFAA) have slightly different rules. What they have in common in their barebow definition is no sights, no releases. Many do allow elevated rests, cushioned plungers, counterweights/stabilizers, etc.

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Old 07-13-2018, 11:55 AM   #23
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It depends - governing organizations (FITA, IFAA, NFAA) have slightly different rules. What they have in common in their barebow definition is no sights, no releases. Many do allow elevated rests, cushioned plungers, counterweights/stabilizers, etc.
Fair enough. Thanks Jerp.
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Old 07-13-2018, 01:49 PM   #24
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Here's how I see it.

There are those who shoot instinctive, and those who can't get the hang of it.

There are those who gap shoot, and those who can't get the hang of it.

There are those who face walk, and those who can't get the hang of it.

There are those who string walk, and those who can't get the hang of it.

There are those who excel in whichever method they choose, and there are those who do not.

In ALL of the above, the archer is using ONLY the bow, string & arrow to make the shot, with NO added accessories, and each has chosen the method they are the most comfortable, and confident with.

There should be NO distinction, determination, consideration in which to split them into different classes, because when there is no equipment difference it all falls onto the shooters abilities to make the shot. No more. No less.

Rick
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Old 07-13-2018, 03:13 PM   #25
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I agree it's up to the shooter to make the shot.
I don't agree that all of the sightless aiming methods are on equal standing competition wise.
However I'm not worried about it because when I shoot it's about me and how I perform to my expectations. Not the other shooters.
I can see someone who wanted to be competitive having an issue with it.


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Old 07-13-2018, 03:42 PM   #26
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I don't agree that all of the sightless aiming methods are on equal standing competition wise.
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The argument could easily be made, that one persons method of instinctive shooting isn't on equal standing competition wise as that of another instinctive shooter. Lots of definitions of instinctive floating around out there.

I can remember a time when folks threw a fit over someone shooting 3 under, and have personally seen shooters get chastised & disqualified from shoots for it. For the most part those days are long gone, Thank Goodness.

Point is - where equipment is equal - the accomplished shooters are going to rise to the top no matter what the rules of sighting methods are.

Just as an aside - I also remember folks complaining about stick on elevated rests, even though the one who was the brunt of most of their complaints could probably throw the arrow by hand, and still beat a lot of them. Sure, there definitely needs to be a line drawn on equipment, but I personally believe the socker mom mentality has taken that line to beyond the extreme.

That said - I follow, and shoot within the rules set forth by whatever venue I am shooting in. If there's enough about certain rules, that I don't like, then I just don't shoot, or I shoot as a non competitor. It's pretty simple, and keeps me happy.

Rick
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Old 07-14-2018, 01:35 PM   #27
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I'm right handed and shoot split finger instinctive.

I had a scout challenge me at summer camp. He is a very good shot for no more than he shoots.

First round he beat me 53 to 47 out of a possible 60 points. I hadn't shot the bow before but it was just 26lbs draw at 28 so after the first couple shots I was dialed in. Later in the afternoon he wanted to go left handed and after a couple practice rounds was doing decent. Then the challenge came for that. Having never shot left handed I asked for one 6 arrow end to prepare. I knew the best chance I had to be coordinated enough to not look stupid and accurate enough to be competitive I would need to shoot three under, string walk and figure out what if any gap in those 6 arrows. I did so and he knew then it was over. In the 6 arrows of the challenge I had two 10s, five 9s and one 8.

Granted it was only 10 yards. But I had never shot left handed before. I had not shot three under or string walked before. I had watched a couple of videos and Rick can tell you we've had some discussions about it before.

It's not the same as instinctive shooting. It's easier to get adequate at it at short ranges for most shooters. That's why the guy who does "the push" is so popular.

People look for the easier way. That's why they buy the sight with a level and range finder built in. Always looking for the edge.

And I really don't think that's bad but I do think it puts the average instinctive shooter at a disadvantage competition wise.

Let the lashes with a wet noodle begin.


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Old 07-14-2018, 01:52 PM   #28
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I'm right handed and shoot split finger instinctive.

I had a scout challenge me at summer camp. He is a very good shot for no more than he shoots.

First round he beat me 53 to 47 out of a possible 60 points. I hadn't shot the bow before but it was just 26lbs draw at 28 so after the first couple shots I was dialed in. Later in the afternoon he wanted to go left handed and after a couple practice rounds was doing decent. Then the challenge came for that. Having never shot left handed I asked for one 6 arrow end to prepare. I knew the best chance I had to be coordinated enough to not look stupid and accurate enough to be competitive I would need to shoot three under, string walk and figure out what if any gap in those 6 arrows. I did so and he knew then it was over. In the 6 arrows of the challenge I had two 10s, five 9s and one 8.

Granted it was only 10 yards. But I had never shot left handed before. I had not shot three under or string walked before. I had watched a couple of videos and Rick can tell you we've had some discussions about it before.

It's not the same as instinctive shooting. It's easier to get adequate at it at short ranges for most shooters. That's why the guy who does "the push" is so popular.

People look for the easier way. That's why they buy the sight with a level and range finder built in. Always looking for the edge.

And I really don't think that's bad but I do think it puts the average instinctive shooter at a disadvantage competition wise.

Let the lashes with a wet noodle begin.


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Granted it was only 10 yards.

That says a mouth full.

Any method takes a lot of work to get it where it is working.

String walking not only involves good form to pull it off, because you are adversely influencing your tune when you do it, thus it also requires you to be spot on with your tune for it to be consistent & reliable.

It's not something you can just got out & do willy nilly, and count on. Well maybe at 10 yards.

Rick
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Old 07-14-2018, 01:59 PM   #29
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Stringwalking - if you are good at guessing distances - can give a distinct advantage IMO. Whether it is an unfair advantage is a matter of opinion. I think disallowing it goes back to the early days of 3D where you had two types of competitors. Many were hunters looking for competition as a realistic hunting experience but others came over from field archery where stringwalking is very common. There was conflict between two groups and the instinctive/gap guys won the argument. I’ve seen string walkers at our field shoots - remarkably accurate from known distances.

Last edited by jerp; 07-14-2018 at 02:02 PM.
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Old Today, 07:53 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickBarbee View Post
Here's how I see it.

There are those who shoot instinctive, and those who can't get the hang of it.

There are those who gap shoot, and those who can't get the hang of it.

There are those who face walk, and those who can't get the hang of it.

There are those who string walk, and those who can't get the hang of it.

There are those who excel in whichever method they choose, and there are those who do not.

In ALL of the above, the archer is using ONLY the bow, string & arrow to make the shot, with NO added accessories, and each has chosen the method they are the most comfortable, and confident with.

There should be NO distinction, determination, consideration in which to split them into different classes, because when there is no equipment difference it all falls onto the shooters abilities to make the shot. No more. No less.

Rick


This is spot on! I once more have to agree with Rick. We all gap at some point in some way. The arrow goes up and gravity takes it down! It's when you use peep sights and releases that are the real differences. Making the aiming smaller on small. If you don't know known distances by what ever method it's still a guessing game. The better you are at guessing the better archer. At the end
of the day all groups try to get there numbers up at the shoots how ever they can. Arvin
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Old Today, 10:39 AM   #31
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since I don't go to asa shoots. ill just keep it to myself
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Old Today, 11:08 AM   #32
RJH1
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Dont want anyone thinking this will be replacing the trad class, they are adding barebow, but you can still shoot trad if you like. Don't know if that was clear
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