Energy and Long Range

[Radar]

I met a fella the other day at the range, and he had to come down and "see" what I was shooting. He proceeded to tell me about shooting Auodads at 1700 yards and he had killed an Elk at 1500 yards with a 7mm mag. He gave me his bullet and ballistics data, saying he was going to New Mexico this fall for the 2000 plus yard Elk. I never said a word back to him and said well I need to get back to shooting.

Today I decided to plug in his ballistic info on JBM. Berger Hunter 150gr bullet and 3200 fps load of some sort. With his load the energy at 1000 yards is 790 ft lbs and velocity is 1540 fps. Now Berger says that their hunting bullets need at least 1800 fps to expand and most gun gurus will say 750 ft lbs of energy is the minimum requirement. At 2000 yards his energy would be 262 ft lbs and velocity would be 887 fps. So with that info(if reliable) do you think he is truthful?

[coop2564]

Bergers will often tumble inside body cavity once they get to a low velocity which can do some damage in on itself. But more than likely dude is full of BS!

[Slick8]

Some people just like to hear themselves talk and take their BS from the high end of plausible to the ridiculous.

Did he by chance work at Academy?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk

[Radar]

Bergers will often tumble inside body cavity once they get to a low velocity which can do some damage in on itself. But more than likely dude is full of BS!

Yes sir, I would agree with you and say a lot of bullets tumble at low velocity and this might make up for no expansion but would hurt penetration. I have tried to locate some of new Nosler Accubond LR bullets but they all gone. According to Nosler they will still expand and perform at 1300 fps.

[Radar]

Some people just like to hear themselves talk and take their BS from the high end of plausible to the ridiculous.

Did he by chance work at Academy?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk

, Lol.

[cva34]

He probably got (waterfront property) in AZ for sale

[Slick8]

I don't buy that tumbling thing or want to count on it happening. That bullet is just as likely to go straight in with no expansion just like an FMJ. The animal will die if the shot is good but will take a long time due to the lack of tissue damage.

Even if a bullet is tumbling it's simply not causing the massive damage and trauma of a bullet at 2000 fps or faster.

[QDM4fun]

You sure he wasn’t shooting a Creedmoor???

[Carpe_diem]

I hope he tries it out on a few 2000 yard hogs first, just to be sure it will do the job.

[Outbreaker]

I don't buy that tumbling thing or want to count on it happening. That bullet is just as likely to go straight in with no expansion just like an FMJ. The animal will die if the shot is good but will take a long time due to the lack of tissue damage.

Even if a bullet is tumbling it's simply not causing the massive damage and trauma of a bullet at 2000 fps or faster.

At lower velocities or when it transitions into a water density the heavy end of the bullet wants to go first and initiates tumbling because the weight of a bullet is in the rear.

Have you ever shot an arrow whos FOC was off? Imagine if the FOC was toward the fletchings (like a bullet)........it would tumble like a bullet will.

The FMJ solids that are made for Dangerous game do not have a rearward FOC like most bullets.

[Radar]

I have read a few articles on how bullets tumble in tests on wet newspaper, but I think it may be caused from the bullet not being stabilized at low velocity. I would have to say that if it does tumble inside the animal the penetration would not be deep.

[Outbreaker]

I have read a few articles on how bullets tumble in tests on wet newspaper, but I think it may be caused from the bullet not being stabilized at low velocity. I would have to say that if it does tumble inside the animal the penetration would not be deep.

They will tumble in any water density test unless the bullet deforms (read expand) so that the FOC changes and it becomes stable.

A tumbling bullet at low velocity will tear up tissue and will loose penetration power as the KE is being transformed to work.

A tumbling bullet at high velocity (like a berger or SMK) will usually explode due to the structural integrity of the bullet not hold together. This will also cause a loss of penetration as almost all of the KE will be dumped into the tissues usually causing enough damage for the animal to be DRT.

[Radar]

They will tumble in any water density test unless the bullet deforms (read expand) so that the FOC changes and it becomes stable.

A tumbling bullet at low velocity will tear up tissue and will loose penetration power as the KE is being transformed to work.

A tumbling bullet at high velocity (like a berger or SMK) will usually explode due to the structural integrity of the bullet not hold together. This will also cause a loss of penetration as almost all of the KE will be dumped into the tissues usually causing enough damage for the animal to be DRT.

Pretty cool stuff, rather simple explanation. Probably some sort of bonded bullet would be best for shooting animals at a long distance.

[Outbreaker]

Pretty cool stuff, rather simple explanation. Probably some sort of bonded bullet would be best for shooting animals at a long distance.

But many bonded bullets will not perform at low impact velocities.

I would lean toward something that tends to over expand like an NBT/GMX etc.

[Radar]

Be a trade off with that Ballistic Tip on a close shot, long shot you probably right. So, did he kill the animals at 1700 yards? Lol.