9mm vs 40 s&w vs 45 ACP?

[kumathebear]

If you have ever been curious, or just want to argue one caliber over another in handguns, take some time to read this? This article does NOT compare 10mm, my personal favorite, but it "seems to provide" a more historical and LEO tested competition? (I'm also a 45 ACP fan as well.) "If you are a ONLY Wheel type, this then is a waste of your time...read on."

One of the main points I took from this article is "accuracy" and multiple round capacity to hit center mass and NOT Head Shots. At least for me, this "hit's home" on why I prefer higher capacity magazines vs the "less than 10 round" capability of various models. A "little more model handgun size" does not bother me to have the higher magazine capacity.

I'll quickly admit, I'm a HELL of a lot better with a rifle than a handgun, even qualifying as a LEO years past will evidence.

Yeah, retired so I have a LOT of time to research and start another debate...

http://abesguncave.com/9mm-vs-40-sw-vs-45-acp/

Hope you enjoy this perspective, after numerous web time...just for grins!

[Drycreek3189]

That’s a novel idea, never heard that debate before

[RJH1]

I love how articles like this contradict themselves. Says pistol bullets only poke holes, then says a 45 is only .12 inch bigger and ignores the fact that equals %25 more surface area, so %25 more hole, (seems like a good thing if poking holes is all we can do, right?). Then says they are all equal, then shows chart showing 9mm is the least equal of the bunch.

One other thing that is always missed it that the FBI said a bullet needs to do X, so ammo companies made ammo for all 3 that meets that criteria, but fails to mention that the 9 is loaded to +P to make that happen and the 40 and 45 are loaded significantly lighter than they can be to meet that criteria. So the 40 and 45 can be turned up considerably.

I do agree that shot placement trumps all, however, and 9 is the easiest to do that with if you are weaker (gotta get the women in the FBI) and/or don't practice

[okrattler]

If the size of the hole you're making in a live target doesn't matter then why do people worry about what they carry in bear country? It's kind of common sense that shooting something (especially something trying to kill you) in the brain,spine or heart is better than shooting it in the leg. Yeah you're poking holes in it with anything but what goes on inside the target matters. The weight of the bullet,type of bullet and what it does when it hits meat and bone matters. If it didn't everyone would just carry a .22lr.

I get the need for having more bullets. But isn't that kind of going against what that article is saying? If you're hitting the target to incapacitate then why have 10+ rounds? It shouldn't take that many. I noticed a lot of famous quotes being repeated for affect but everything about that article contradicts what he had just talked about the more I read.

[Phillip Fields]

The very last two lines of the "Handgun Wounding Factors and Effectiveness" published by FBI Academy Firearms Training Division:

"Any bullet which will not penetrate through vital organs from less than optimal angles is not acceptable. Of those that will penetrate, the edge is always with the bigger bullet."

[westtexducks]

I am a 9mm guy purely from a rounds on target and ease of putting those rounds on target standpoint. I don’t give a rip if a .45 gives me 25% more hole when I can put three more holes in the target compared to the 45. Let’s use an XDM for example 19 rounds of 9mm vs 13 of .45 acp. With the 9mm I have 7.22 inches of hole I can put in the target. With the .45 I only have 5.85. If I hit the target 3 times to your 2 I put 1.14 inches of hole you only put .9 this is a no brainer to me.

Also like mentioned above most all of the commercial ammo is designed to meet the fbi standard so for run of the mill ammo that is all going to perform about the same I would rather have the ability to put more rounds on target.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Phillip Fields]

I am a 9mm guy purely from a rounds on target and ease of putting those rounds on target standpoint. I don’t give a rip if a .45 gives me 25% more hole when I can put three more holes in the target compared to the 45. Let’s use an XDM for example 19 rounds of 9mm vs 13 of .45 acp. With the 9mm I have 7.22 inches of hole I can put in the target. With the .45 I only have 5.85. If I hit the target 3 times to your 2 I put 1.14 inches of hole you only put .9 this is a no brainer to me.

Also like mentioned above most all of the commercial ammo is designed to meet the fbi standard so for run of the mill ammo that is all going to perform about the same I would rather have the ability to put more rounds on target.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good premise, but your math is wrong. 9mm is .355 diameter so 19 X .355 is 6.745; .45 ACP diameter is .451 so 13 X .451 is 5.863. 3 hits from 9mm = 1.065, 2 hits from a .45 = .902

[RJH1]

I am a 9mm guy purely from a rounds on target and ease of putting those rounds on target standpoint. I don’t give a rip if a .45 gives me 25% more hole when I can put three more holes in the target compared to the 45. Let’s use an XDM for example 19 rounds of 9mm vs 13 of .45 acp. With the 9mm I have 7.22 inches of hole I can put in the target. With the .45 I only have 5.85. If I hit the target 3 times to your 2 I put 1.14 inches of hole you only put .9 this is a no brainer to me.

Also like mentioned above most all of the commercial ammo is designed to meet the fbi standard so for run of the mill ammo that is all going to perform about the same I would rather have the ability to put more rounds on target.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't really disagree with anything you said. My opinion is different because I don't use Factory ammo. I carry a 40 and my 180 grain loads are virtually identical to factory 10mil loads. An interesting video is on luckygunner.com, they have videos of lots of different ammo being shot at ballistic gel. If you look at the Hornady 180 grain 10mm load being fired into gel vs any 9 mil, 40, or 45 you'll see there's a tremendous amount more disruption. My point is that the 40 can be loaded to equal that 10 mm load, and that's what I am getting at when I say that the nine is maxed out to meet the FBI standards and the 40 and 45 is loaded down. I don't know how much it difference it would actually make in a defensive situation, but since everybody says 10 mm is like the hand of God it makes me feel better :-)

[TxAg]

Good premise, but your math is wrong. 9mm is .355 diameter so 19 X .355 is 6.745; .45 ACP diameter is .451 so 13 X .451 is 5.863. 3 hits from 9mm = 1.065, 2 hits from a .45 = .902

He was referencing post #3

[kumathebear]

I don't really disagree with anything you said. My opinion is different because I don't use Factory ammo. I carry a 40 and my 180 grain loads are virtually identical to factory 10mil loads. An interesting video is on luckygunner.com, they have videos of lots of different ammo being shot at ballistic gel. If you look at the Hornady 180 grain 10mm load being fired into gel vs any 9 mil, 40, or 45 you'll see there's a tremendous amount more disruption. My point is that the 40 can be loaded to equal that 10 mm load, and that's what I am getting at when I say that the nine is maxed out to meet the FBI standards and the 40 and 45 is loaded down. I don't know how much it difference it would actually make in a defensive situation, but since everybody says 10 mm is like the hand of God it makes me feel better :-)

I've seen the video you mentioned and another reason why I like the 10. I quit reloading years past so dependent on factory loads. All I know is what the 10 will do to hogs out of a blind at reasonable range (per my skills,) DRT.

[ultrastealth]

He fails to mention one more important factor: capacity. Most of the wonder nines carry 15+ cartridges. Most .45's carry 8-10 rounds. Yes, that may be enough in most gun fights, but you don't get to pick and choose your fight. Most home invasions involve 2+ attackers. Police hit rates run around 30%. So, three guys decide to kick your door in and you need to get at least 2 hits on each one to stop them. That's a minimum of 6 hits. Well, if you are anything like police, you will need 18+ shots to achieve that. That's another reason that magazine restrictions are a bad idea. Once again, you don't get to pick your gun fight, and you only have one life to lose. This isn't a video game.

[TacticalCowboy]

I like the 45 the least out of any of them. I have met a guy that was shot several times by LE with a 45, including being struck in the head, and he’s still here.

As far as 9 vs 40 goes, I still am undecided. I carry a g19, but have pondered a g23. There is only a two round difference in the g19/g23 or a g22/g17. Hmm.

The only thing I ever killed with a pistol cartridge was a couple Axis deer. A 180 grain cast bullet in the heart at 40 yards did him in. I was using a Para 16-40.

[muddydog]

I like all 3. To me the important issue is accuracy. Next is bullet choices for each. The wrong bullet in any of them doesn't work well. All 3 have proven statistics and service. My current self defense home gun is the Glock 22. With 180 grain JHP. I prefer a heavier bullet in all calibers and the 40SW is a little easier on the wallet than a 45 when buying ammo for range time. I also think a 12 ga. Pump is better than any handgun for home defense.

Sent from my moto e5 cruise using Tapatalk

[Jspradley]

All handgun calibers suck pretty much equally so the entire debate is literally meaningless.

[Norseman]

The federal HST 124gr +P round has rendered 40 and 45 obsolete. There is a reason the FBI and SS went back to 9mm, and adopted the Glock 19 gen 5 MOS.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk