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Old 12-02-2020, 08:19 AM   #1
Spearchunker
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Default Help, Starting a Protein Plan

Come February I plan to start a protein plan on my 12k corporate lease. Yes I know it will be expensive..

As of now thoughts are 5 ea 2k# stations.

My question is best way to purchase and fill them. Obviously I don't want #40 bags, and need suggestions on filling system.

We have sooo many deer I think its best for a timed system to save some money.

Anyone that can share input on large ranch feed would be appreciated.

Lease is in Hall Co near Childress.

Much appreciated,

Sean
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:28 AM   #2
JMart76
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Ask your local feed stores if they will deliver or fill your feeders when you order in bulk. If not ask around for someone who offers that service. Some feed stores offer delivery and you can generally get feed at a lower price when you buy in bulk.
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:32 AM   #3
fordsuper08
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I think you are good with the amount of feeders you are thinking and 2k should hold a little while after the first month or so you will have a better idea of how much the deer will eat i would search around the area and check with feed stores to see if they have a blower trailer for rent if you buy feed from them also you might ask outfitters who they use
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:35 AM   #4
bbqfan5909
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Going timed will limit the amount of mouths fed and will take away the advantage of feeding protein. While it will help some, wont get the full benefit.

Your out in cotton country where you should be able to get cotton seed rather cheap. Might look at that for an alternative and I'm sure a local farmer would plant plots also.
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:39 AM   #5
warrington
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Default Too many deer

My first concern is stating that you have too many deer. That could be true. Instead of rationing the amount of protein, I would suggest to sell hunts for your cull does or your does. If he sold for does a year for $500 apiece and one buck con fcull buck that would covered $2500 worth of proteins. That would offset having to put a timed feeder on the system. It would also help with the vast number of deer population that you have there
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:39 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by bbqfan5909 View Post
Going timed will limit the amount of mouths fed and will take away the advantage of feeding protein. While it will help some, wont get the full benefit.

Your out in cotton country where you should be able to get cotton seed rather cheap. Might look at that for an alternative and I'm sure a local farmer would plant plots also.


We have 3 winter wheat feilds, approx 400 acres now. Owner only plants wheat for cattle. We will not turn cows on them until we are all done hunting.

What could he plant for me after the wheat? Problem is the drought out here, hate to risk the planting and no rain..
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:44 AM   #7
warrington
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Cotton seed is half the price of protein
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:44 AM   #8
DUKFVR
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One thing I will say about timed feeders is it will help more than some think. I have 4 + yrs doing it. Your better deer will get there's. They will be there when it opens in the AM. The deer will feed all day off & on if they need it or want it. I use the krivoman feeders & set them to close at 6 in the evening & open 7 in the AM.
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:52 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by warrington View Post
My first concern is stating that you have too many deer. That could be true. Instead of rationing the amount of protein, I would suggest to sell hunts for your cull does or your does. If he sold for does a year for $500 apiece and one buck con fcull buck that would covered $2500 worth of proteins. That would offset having to put a timed feeder on the system. It would also help with the vast number of deer population that you have there

We are probably 80% mule deer to 20% WT.

We do have some WT culls, and trying to knock them down now.

We can not shoot mule deer does..yet. next year we will have mule doe permits and then we leave all WT does alone. We only killed one so far, and not shooting any more.

In 2 years we will be MLD, then I may sell hunts.

We have 200k pics in 8 weeks and not one WT fawn. I was talking with local tpwd biologists (Dana Wright) and this area had less than 1% WT survival this year due to drought and yotes.

I have 2 helicopters booked in early March to perform MLD surveys and shoot yotes and pigs.

We have many very old mule deer bucks that don't meet 20". Once we get MLD that rule is void so we will be killing them all!!

Our wheat feilds are amazing! Easy 70 mulies on them everyday with old dudes in the mix.

Thanks guys for some guidance!!
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Old 12-02-2020, 08:55 AM   #10
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Cotton seed is half the price of protein
Hey bud, foot is all good now!! Took a while for all pain to go away.

Local TPWD biologists advised against due to some sort of poisoning from high dosage of cotton seed?
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Old 12-02-2020, 09:07 AM   #11
warrington
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Cotton seed is half the price of protein
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Old 12-02-2020, 09:57 AM   #12
mikemorvan
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Originally Posted by DUKFVR View Post
One thing I will say about timed feeders is it will help more than some think. I have 4 + yrs doing it. Your better deer will get there's. They will be there when it opens in the AM. The deer will feed all day off & on if they need it or want it. I use the krivoman feeders & set them to close at 6 in the evening & open 7 in the AM.
We've gone to this strategery and it works. I open mine at 30 minutes before sunrise, and close 30 minutes after sunset.
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Old 12-02-2020, 10:32 AM   #13
sotx
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Cotton seed is half the price of protein
Where is this happening? Its not in McMullen County. Here its about the same price as protein.
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Old 12-02-2020, 10:33 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Spearchunker View Post
Hey bud, foot is all good now!! Took a while for all pain to go away.

Local TPWD biologists advised against due to some sort of poisoning from high dosage of cotton seed?
Been feeding cotton for years, never heard of this and have not had deer die from it.
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Old 12-02-2020, 07:18 PM   #15
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Just pull the seed a couple months before the rut.

IMO-- if feeding protein,free choice is the best option as it will not exclude age classes. When bucks are in batchelor groups, the dominant buck will eat and not allow others to eat. When he leaves they all leave with him. Two sources will help at each station such as protein and seed in the same pen.
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Old 12-02-2020, 07:32 PM   #16
retrieverman
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I’ve got a friend that hunts around Childress and buys protein from Balkum(sp?)Feed.
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Old 12-02-2020, 10:07 PM   #17
warrington
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Cotton seed $275 a ton
Protein $550 a ton


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Old 12-05-2020, 06:01 PM   #18
Throwin Darts
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Originally Posted by DUKFVR View Post
One thing I will say about timed feeders is it will help more than some think. I have 4 + yrs doing it. Your better deer will get there's. They will be there when it opens in the AM. The deer will feed all day off & on if they need it or want it. I use the krivoman feeders & set them to close at 6 in the evening & open 7 in the AM.

This is my experience too. My more mature bucks get feeder time. We shot a buck last year and had one of his sheds from the previous year. He was 7 and added 20 inches on one side. I have three timed Krivomanís open during daylight and fed 22,000 pounds on 640 acres. Buy in bulk and have the feed store fill the cameras. It ends up being cheaper than buying bags and filling yourself.


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Old 12-05-2020, 07:35 PM   #19
elgato
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If I understand correctly you are putting 5 feeders on 12,000 acres... a feeder per 2400 acres. You are exploring timed feeders cause you are worried about cost and at same time have sooo many deer; too many?

Everything about this tells me you are off to a bad start.Were it me I would forget protein and invest in bullets, seed I could plant year round and maybe go with cotton seed but even then to see realistic results you probably need about 60 stations and be prepared to wait 3-4 years to see results.

Not trying to be debbie downer but I think you are wasting your time and money on a protein program your describing that will yield essentially inconsequential results.

Now if you are allowed to grow crops that is a different story and for the same money would give you value

Just read what biologist said about cotton seed killing deer. Suggest you find a new biologist. We feed about 8-10 18 wheeler loads a year for the last umpteen years. Herd is doing fine. Also have a protein feeder per 100 acres. Feeding protein and worried about cost doesn't mix well especially on a 12,000 acre ranch

Last edited by elgato; 12-05-2020 at 07:44 PM.
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Old 12-05-2020, 08:56 PM   #20
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do you have plenty of water available. They use to think cotton seed made bucks sterile but only if they are feed cottonseed and no natural browse. Maybe the biologist is concerned about the poor drought conditions with no browse to supplement the feeding of cottonseed. Anyways if cottonseed seed is effects deer in a bad way about 10 million deer are being effected right now. Feed cottonseed by bulk vs protein.
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Old 12-06-2020, 10:29 PM   #21
BIG BONE
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Originally Posted by Spearchunker View Post
We have 3 winter wheat feilds, approx 400 acres now. Owner only plants wheat for cattle. We will not turn cows on them until we are all done hunting.

What could he plant for me after the wheat? Problem is the drought out here, hate to risk the planting and no rain..
Is there anymore acreage you could plant besides the 400 acres? How many deer per acre do you have on the place?
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Old 12-22-2020, 05:12 PM   #22
Spearchunker
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Is there anymore acreage you could plant besides the 400 acres? How many deer per acre do you have on the place?
No other areas to plant. The owner did agree today to lablab on about 200 acres of the wheat feilds. Seriously considering this route and year round corn feeders.

LabLab says you can broadcast. Pretty tough to get a drill to these fields. Rancher has a 2500# broadcaster with 40' reach I can use.

Any one have experience with LabLab?

Have no clue how many deer we have, but its a lot right now. We have doubled our numbers since wheat took. Owners says they migrate from all neighbors places. Not too many around us have wheat. He says they will leave once feilds are done. Plan is to keep them around.

I can't use bullets unfortunately.
No MLD and owner isn't fan of MLD and so far not interested..Can't shoot any mule does either per TX. We have tons of old muley bucks with heavy horns, but not 20". Have some challenges for sure with this place.
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Old 12-22-2020, 07:41 PM   #23
elgato
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I've planted lab lab and think you will not have great success broadcasting it unless you get really lucky with rain. You might consider trying cow peas. They are cheaper than lab lab with many of the same characteristics so if you have a failure it won't cost as much.
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Old 12-24-2020, 10:18 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elgato View Post
If I understand correctly you are putting 5 feeders on 12,000 acres... a feeder per 2400 acres. You are exploring timed feeders cause you are worried about cost and at same time have sooo many deer; too many?

Everything about this tells me you are off to a bad start.Were it me I would forget protein and invest in bullets, seed I could plant year round and maybe go with cotton seed but even then to see realistic results you probably need about 60 stations and be prepared to wait 3-4 years to see results.

Not trying to be debbie downer but I think you are wasting your time and money on a protein program your describing that will yield essentially inconsequential results.

Now if you are allowed to grow crops that is a different story and for the same money would give you value

Just read what biologist said about cotton seed killing deer. Suggest you find a new biologist. We feed about 8-10 18 wheeler loads a year for the last umpteen years. Herd is doing fine. Also have a protein feeder per 100 acres. Feeding protein and worried about cost doesn't mix well especially on a 12,000 acre ranch
This

Five 2k lb feeders is what we have on 2600ac and we could use a couple more
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Old 12-30-2020, 09:22 PM   #25
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Agreed with what others are saying. I would try to lower the deer numbers first and foremost. if you are trying to make a big difference with protein or any type of supplemental feeding you will need to have a feeding station every 500 acres at the very least. We have one feeding station per 100 acres but our place is a lot smaller. There are some good studies on Caesar Kleberg that show the proper rate for feed stations need to be 1/200 acres in order to make a big difference and feed bucks, doe, and fawns. Itís all about how much $ you are willing to spend and what your goals are. 12,000 acres would be hard to manage for a couple of full time ranch hands.


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Old 01-06-2021, 04:06 PM   #26
Steel185
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https://podtail.com/en/podcast/deer-...tal-feeding-p/

Listen to this podcast. I think you will need to go all in or not at all. If you want bigger deer maybe money on high fence in the best 1k ac of the property and then a deer feeding program would be more the results you actually want.
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Old 01-06-2021, 09:42 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Steel185 View Post
https://podtail.com/en/podcast/deer-...tal-feeding-p/

Listen to this podcast. I think you will need to go all in or not at all. If you want bigger deer maybe money on high fence in the best 1k ac of the property and then a deer feeding program would be more the results you actually want.
You gotta have waaaaaaayyyyyyy more money than sense to build a high fence on leased property.
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Old 01-06-2021, 10:47 PM   #28
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You gotta have waaaaaaayyyyyyy more money than sense to build a high fence on leased property.

I didnít catch it was a lease.

But my point and the point of the Dr of wild life management is thatís itís impossible to make a significant increase in deer size with food/protein in a low fence situation.

So if that is your goal, itís not realistic, so you might as well build a high fence on a lease and then youíd be able to do it. One way would be expensive and not smart investment, but you could hit your goal in 3-4 years. The other would be a lot of protein spent on a lease and no increase in deer size. Not hitting goal.
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Old 01-07-2021, 08:27 AM   #29
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You gotta have waaaaaaayyyyyyy more money than sense to build a high fence on leased property.
I know some guys who did just that for a long term lease and you are right they had way more money than sense.
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Old 01-07-2021, 08:33 AM   #30
SHSU18
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We feed protein through the 2k timed all season feeders. The deer were sucking our feeders dry way to fast when it was free choice. We feed about 30-45 seconds in the morning and the same in the evening. We have 7 feeders on 1600 acres.
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Old 01-08-2021, 03:38 PM   #31
Spearchunker
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Decided to add more corn feeders and some minerals.

Then approx 3 ea 10 acre summer plots spread out in the existing wheat feilds.

Appreciate the input fellas.

Sean
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Old 01-08-2021, 04:10 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spearchunker View Post
Come February I plan to start a protein plan on my 12k corporate lease. Yes I know it will be expensive..

As of now thoughts are 5 ea 2k# stations.

My question is best way to purchase and fill them. Obviously I don't want #40 bags, and need suggestions on filling system.

We have sooo many deer I think its best for a timed system to save some money.

Anyone that can share input on large ranch feed would be appreciated.

Lease is in Hall Co near Childress.

Much appreciated,

Sean
No way 5 protein feeders for 12,000 acres is anywhere near enough. If you are going to feed protein then don't chinch and feed free choice. You are not going to get the benefit if you limit their eating!!!!!! Go big or go home!!!! If you can afford to lease the 12,000 acres you can afford more protein feeders!!!!! If you had 1 protein for every 500 acres you would need 24 proteins Buy more!!!!!!!
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Old 01-09-2021, 09:34 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DEADEYE1 View Post
No way 5 protein feeders for 12,000 acres is anywhere near enough. If you are going to feed protein then don't chinch and feed free choice. You are not going to get the benefit if you limit their eating!!!!!! Go big or go home!!!! If you can afford to lease the 12,000 acres you can afford more protein feeders!!!!! If you had 1 protein for every 500 acres you would need 24 proteins Buy more!!!!!!!

This ^^^


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Old 01-09-2021, 02:52 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Spearchunker View Post
We have 3 winter wheat feilds, approx 400 acres now. Owner only plants wheat for cattle. We will not turn cows on them until we are all done hunting.

What could he plant for me after the wheat? Problem is the drought out here, hate to risk the planting and no rain..
Are you asking about a summer planting, I’m assuming?
It depends on when he terminated the wheat, or harvests if he lets it go to grain.
You could do a blend with several grass family plants like sorghum or Sudan grass and mix some Sunn hemp and cowpeas in there for the deer. He could even get a summer grazing in there right before planting back into wheat.

Gabe Brown is a farmer/rancher in the dakotas who uses diverse blends as cover crops between cash crops, and he does blends that will offer grazing for his cattle as well as simply cover between crops. I think the trick would be to make whatever the owner plants beneficial to both you AND his operation. If you don’t want to do much research of your own, you could give the guys at Greencoverseed.com a call and their experts can recommend a blend. You could do the call alongside the owner so he/she feels comfortable with the plan and fully understands how best to utilize and implement it.

Edit: I think you would get a LOT more nutritional benefit per dollar spent on a high quality planting like I mention above than on protein. If you are looking at just doing the 10 protein stations, I would work really hard at finding a way to get that 400 acres into some kind of summer nutrition.

Last edited by IkemanTX; 01-09-2021 at 02:57 PM.
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Old 01-20-2021, 03:12 PM   #35
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A few thoughts

I think you should focus on cotton seed. Figure out a large feeder system that can be filled directly by a tractor. It is way easier and cheaper to feed cotton seed.

Food plots are going to be hard to count on in your area and will fail when the deer need them the most. The more years you get good rain in a row, the worse it will be on the herd when you get a drought year.

Not sure about your water situation, but I have seen a good water station every 350 acres really help on fawn survival. A lot of places I see that have preditors under control and still a low fawn crop tend to not have a lot of surface water.

Whitetail deer are a dime a dozen in Texas. Be proud of your mule deer. If you can grow a trophy mule deer in Texas, that is something unique. Give them food and let them reach a mature age.

Sounds like you are asking the right questions. Enjoy the process.
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Old 01-21-2021, 02:46 PM   #36
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I have 3, 1000lb free choice protein stations that I feed year round on my 1/2 section in Irion Co. Even w/ 3 stations going, keeping them full by myself is a serious chore.

Setting the cost aside, if i was setting up a protein feeding program on 12000 low fence acres in Hall Co. and wanted to see meaningful results, this is what i would do.

I would set up 1 station per 500 acres with a minimum of a 1000lb free choice feeder in each pen.

Make each pen 8 panels.

Hire the local feed store to come once a month with their feed blower trailer, and fill everything for you. (I'd try and find a local high school kid to build the pens)

I'd also have a heli survey done asap and get a good count of your herd numbers. If you are way over carrying capacity - I'd make it a 2021 priority to get numbers into balance.

I think you are looking at about $25000 in materials to get it rolling (feeders, panels & t-posts) $20% seems to be $12-$14/bag now...
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Old 01-27-2021, 12:19 AM   #37
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This is going to be expensive

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Old 01-27-2021, 12:20 AM   #38
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I have 3, 1000lb free choice protein stations that I feed year round on my 1/2 section in Irion Co. Even w/ 3 stations going, keeping them full by myself is a serious chore.

Setting the cost aside, if i was setting up a protein feeding program on 12000 low fence acres in Hall Co. and wanted to see meaningful results, this is what i would do.

I would set up 1 station per 500 acres with a minimum of a 1000lb free choice feeder in each pen.

Make each pen 8 panels.

Hire the local feed store to come once a month with their feed blower trailer, and fill everything for you. (I'd try and find a local high school kid to build the pens)

I'd also have a heli survey done asap and get a good count of your herd numbers. If you are way over carrying capacity - I'd make it a 2021 priority to get numbers into balance.

I think you are looking at about $25000 in materials to get it rolling (feeders, panels & t-posts) $20% seems to be $12-$14/bag now...
agree with this and you'll spend most of the budget feeding mule deer does that you won't be able to remove
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