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Old 11-18-2017, 09:54 AM   #1
Hank Hill
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Default Trump Kowtows to Animal Rights Activists

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a8061911.html

Donald Trump says he is halting a controversial change allowing the import of elephants killed by hunters abroad.

“Put big game trophy decision on hold until such time as I review all conservation facts,” Mr Trump said in a Friday night tweet.

Earlier this week, it emerged that the Trump administration was lifting a ban on importing hunted elephant trophies. The US Fish and Wildlife Service had already moved to begin allowing people to import hunted lion trophies from Zambia and Zimbabwe.

The change drew immediate condemnations from wildlife advocates, who said the change would accelerate the destruction of sensitive species. Both elephants and lions are covered under the Endangered Species Act, a 2015 Fish and Wildlife Service press release announcing lion protections citing the “dramatic decline of lion populations in the wild”.

In an information sheet explaining why it was lifting the elephant import prohibition, the Fish and Wildlife Service noted that Zimbabwe had enacted a national elephant management plan and pointed to improvements in tracking hunting activity and “a more systematic, scientific approach to establish national quotas”.

The Fish and Wildlife Service says on its website that hunting lions can play a “significant role in their conservation”, adding that America is bound by the Endangered Species Act to ensure that “hunters are contributing to the conservation of lions in the wild by participating in hunting programs that provide a clear conservation benefit and contribute to the long-term survival of the species in the wild”.

But the relaxation of restrictions on lion and elephant imports was blasted by Wayne Pacelle of the Humane Society of the United States, who argued that corruption in Zimbabwe – a country grappling with an apparent coup attempt – would undercut proper management and fuel “the pillaging of that nation’s extraordinary wildlife”.

“African elephants and African lions drive billions of dollars of economic activity in Africa,” Mr Pacelle wrote in a blog post. “But they drive that activity only when they are alive. Killing them deducts from their populations, diminishes wildlife-watching experiences for others, and robs the countries of Africa of its greatest resources.”
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Old 11-18-2017, 10:01 AM   #2
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Do these idiots not understand that most of these animals are killed in refuges to generate money to aid in the protection from poaching? Idiots


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Old 11-18-2017, 10:25 AM   #3
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No nards
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Old 11-18-2017, 10:28 AM   #4
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Social media has been blowing up over this

Shame...

I simply don’t have the desire to hunt one however hunting brings in the plata and gives value to the animals. Other wise they’ll continue to be poached and removed from heavily farmed areas... shame

Charismatic megafauna strike again
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Old 11-18-2017, 10:32 AM   #5
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Yes and No! Actually, there was a military takeover (coup) in Zimbabwe earlier this week. The 97 year old President Mugabe was placed under house arrest, along with his 52 year old wife. The situation is very fluid actually. That country (along with Zambia) is at the heart of the elephant import & hunting region. Without understanding of where this is going I understand the "hopefully" temporary halt on imports. Conservation records have shown that the herds are/were stable.........now all bets could be off. Just bad timing honestly!
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Old 11-18-2017, 10:33 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Landrover View Post
Yes and No! Actually, there was a military takeover (coup) in Zimbabwe earlier this week. The 97 year old President Mugabe was placed under house arrest, along with his 52 year old wife. The situation is very fluid actually. That country (along with Zambia) is at the heart of the elephant import & hunting region. Without understanding of where this is going I understand the "hopefully" temporary halt on imports. Conservation records have shown that the herds are/were stable.........now all bets could be off. Just bad timing honestly!


That makes more sense.


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Old 11-18-2017, 11:11 AM   #7
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The conservation evaluation and explanation will never be a winning effort. Even on the right the just idea of killing an elephant is about the same or much worse than hunting a horse or pet dog. I have heard some of the most stupid stuff ever from right wing media in regards to this issue. Trump has bigger battles he wants to fight look for him to fold on this one.

He actually retweeted Piers Morgan supporting him on this.
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Old 11-18-2017, 11:31 AM   #8
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Seems the vast majority of this country is against lifting the ban.


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Old 11-18-2017, 11:40 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Landrover View Post
Yes and No! Actually, there was a military takeover (coup) in Zimbabwe earlier this week. The 97 year old President Mugabe was placed under house arrest, along with his 52 year old wife. The situation is very fluid actually. That country (along with Zambia) is at the heart of the elephant import & hunting region. Without understanding of where this is going I understand the "hopefully" temporary halt on imports. Conservation records have shown that the herds are/were stable.........now all bets could be off. Just bad timing honestly!
Makes sense

Appreciate the insight as always sir
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Old 11-18-2017, 12:19 PM   #10
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Seems the vast majority of this country is against lifting the ban.
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Yes sir........it appears that way. Probably based upon the analogy below akin to horses & dogs. I will say that most American citizens don't even understand bag limits and habitat carrying capacity for deer/geese or even squirrels. We as Americans are sooooo far removed from hunting/fishing that it is NOW an issue in turning that negative tide.
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The conservation evaluation and explanation will never be a winning effort. Even on the right the just idea of killing an elephant is about the same or much worse than hunting a horse or pet dog. I have heard some of the most stupid stuff ever from right wing media in regards to this issue. Trump has bigger battles he wants to fight look for him to fold on this one.

He actually retweeted Piers Morgan supporting him on this.
Per your first sentence? Do you have another idea that can be implemented or even added to the current list of tactics? Education is all we have from what I can tell. It starts with our own kids/grandkids. Some on TBH have even said there own kids are against or don't understand hunting. WE all are in trouble if we cant even educate our own offspring/family. Definitely open to any "winning strategy" you or anyone else may have?
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Makes sense

Appreciate the insight as always sir
WE gotta win this thing in the trenches. With the Trump son's being advid hunters I doubt the administration is caving but the skirmish will get ugly. Here is something we all can help with........if this is truly something other hunters believe in!!! Hopefully the link inside this text below is HOT as it goes straight to our President and Mr. Zinke.

Member Alert
CALL TO ARMS!* SUPPORT*SECRETARY ZINKE & THE FWS DECISION TO IMPORT ELEPHANT TROPHIES FROM ZAMBIA & ZIMBABWE

Use SCI's Action Center to contact President Trump and Secretary of the Interior Zinke now and tell them how much you appreciate the efforts of the Fish & Wildlife Service to remove barriers to sustainable use conservation for African wildlife.*
This week the U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service (FWS) announced that elephants legally hunted in Zimbabwe and Zambia between 2016 and 2018 now can be imported into the United States.* The Service made the announcement at the African Wildlife Consultative Forum, an event co-hosted by the Safari Club International Foundation and the host nation of Tanzania.*
The news from Africa could not have been better for hunters or for anyone who loves or defends hunting culture.* Hunters around the world play an integral role in wildlife conservation and when their rights are restricted, or import bans put in place, wildlife and local African communities all suffer.
This week's FWS announcement is consistent with what conservation scientists and wildlife experts have known for decades—that hunting is beneficial to wildlife and that African range countries know how to manage their elephant populations.
Within hours of the announcement, hysterical anti-hunters and news media outlets went into overdrive, attacking everyone in sight, including the Trump Administration, SCI and even the National Rifle Association of America.* And their efforts seem to have paid off as their shrill, negative reactions has caused President Trump to delay the decision until meeting with Secretary Zinke.
Here's where you can help.* Call or write now and tell President Trump and Secretary Zinke how much you appreciate the efforts of the Fish & Wildlife Service to remove barriers to sustainable use conservation for African wildlife.* Be respectful and tell them you're a proud hunter, that you're not backing down, and that the facts of conservation science are on your side.
Tell them you strongly support the Fish & Wildlife Service's decision to allow the*importation of*elephant trophies from Zambia & Zimbabwe!
Safari Club International - First For Hunters is the leader in protecting the freedom to hunt and in promoting wildlife conservation worldwide. SCI's approximately 200 Chapters represent all 50 of the United States as well as 106 other countries. SCI's proactive leadership in a host of cooperative wildlife conservation, outdoor education and humanitarian programs, with the SCI Foundation and other conservation groups, research institutions and government agencies, empowers sportsmen to be contributing community members and participants in sound wildlife management and conservation. Visit the home page www.SafariClub.org, or call (520) 620-1220 for more information.
International Headquarters Tucson, Arizona · Washington, District of Columbia · Ottawa, Canada
www.SafariClub.org

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Old 11-18-2017, 12:45 PM   #11
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Everyone calm down.

"on hold until..."
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Old 11-18-2017, 01:33 PM   #12
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Sent these to the President and Mr. Zinke...........simple way to support OUR rights as hunters and science based conservation!!



On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 11:23 AM, SCI Hunter Advocacy Department <media@safariclub.org> wrote:
Safari Club International and your fellow sportsmen and women thank you for taking action on this important issue.

You will find copies of your sent messages below:
President Donald Trump (R)
Dear Mr. President:

I am writing to ask you to direct Secretary Zinke to lift the suspension on the issuance of permits for elephants legally hunted in Zimbabwe and Zambia.

I strongly support Secretary Zinke and the US Fish & Wildlife Service's decision to allow the importation of elephant trophies from the African nations of Zambia & Zimbabwe.

Hunting plays an integral role in wildlife conservation around the world and when hunting rights are restricted or import bans put in place, Africa's wildlife and local African communities all suffer.

This week's FWS announcement is consistent with what conservation scientists and wildlife experts have known for decades--that hunting is beneficial to wildlife and that African range countries know how to manage their elephant populations.

I appreciate the efforts of the FWS to remove barriers to sustainable use conservation for African wildlife. I'm a proud hunter, I'm not backing down, and I know that the facts of conservation science are on my side.

Please allow the decision to authorize the import elephant trophies from Zambia & Zimbabwe to move ahead.

Sincerely,

Oscar Taylor
Spring, TX 77386-3805


Ryan Zinke
Dear Secretary Zinke:

I am writing to ask you to direct Secretary Zinke to lift the suspension on the issuance of permits for elephants legally hunted in Zimbabwe and Zambia.

I strongly support Secretary Zinke and the US Fish & Wildlife Service's decision to allow the importation of elephant trophies from the African nations of Zambia & Zimbabwe.

Hunting plays an integral role in wildlife conservation around the world and when hunting rights are restricted or import bans put in place, Africa's wildlife and local African communities all suffer.

This week's FWS announcement is consistent with what conservation scientists and wildlife experts have known for decades--that hunting is beneficial to wildlife and that African range countries know how to manage their elephant populations.

I appreciate the efforts of the FWS to remove barriers to sustainable use conservation for African wildlife. I'm a proud hunter, I'm not backing down, and I know that the facts of conservation science are on my side.

Please allow the decision to authorize the import elephant trophies from Zambia & Zimbabwe to move ahead.

Sincerely,

Oscar Taylor
Spring, TX 77386-3805
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Old 11-18-2017, 02:20 PM   #13
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Trump has voices of reasons from his sons who have been big game hunters. But how does he avoid being the elephant killer?
We live in a time when even meat eaters think their steaks come in plastic wrap from HEB.
Also even hunters are not hard line supporters for big game hunting for a variety of reasons. One of the biggest is that it’s a big money sport and most will never in their lifetime even participate.
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Old 11-18-2017, 08:11 PM   #14
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Trump has voices of reasons from his sons who have been big game hunters. But how does he avoid being the elephant killer?
We live in a time when even meat eaters think their steaks come in plastic wrap from HEB.
Also even hunters are not hard line supporters for big game hunting for a variety of reasons. One of the biggest is that it’s a big money sport and most will never in their lifetime even participate.
Excellent points and dang true, I don't have the full answer but I do have a starting point.
Education is the answer on the first one. The larger conservation/hunting groups are now talking to each other..........which is far different from 6/7/8 or so years ago. Even the NRA is partnering with the larger conservation/hunting groups to get the messages out.
Hunters NOT supporting hunters is a very short sighted view from conversations I have had. Just like folks say, "crap rolls downhill!" Be keenly aware, once any type of LEGAL hunting is outlawed be sure the next target is going to be ELK, DEER, etc.............all the way down to rabbit, racoon & squirrel hunters. It will NOT stop at the so-called big game hunters with lots of perceived spare cash under the mattress. I am far from wealthy but I set a goal as a pre-teen that one day I would participate in all types of hunting. I still recall standing with a single shot Savage .410 in my hand as a child listening to the beagles running a rabbit while day-dreaming about hunting around the world one day like the stories in Outdoor Life magazine. If we as hunters don't come together, we will surely watch our favorite activity slowly geaux away!
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Old 11-19-2017, 01:14 PM   #15
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The anti hunters and usually the left are good at chipping away at the edges of things while keeping there long term goals in mind. No doubt most hate all hunting and add to that their hate of guns. The big game hunters are easy targets because even the right nor other hunters will fight for their privileges.

Look at how people that hunt big game are made to be villains. It ridiculous!

Your .410 savage story is a familiar one as it was my first long gun!
My son would love to go to Africa someday to go big game hunting. I’ve never been but maybe one day we will still be able to go together.
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Old 11-19-2017, 02:45 PM   #16
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Trump doesn't like hunting. Rut row.
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Old 11-20-2017, 07:22 AM   #17
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Trump is writing policy to permanently ban elephant hunting altogether.
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Old 11-20-2017, 10:46 AM   #18
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Trump is writing policy to permanently ban elephant hunting altogether.
How can he write policy that "bans" hunting in another sovereign nation?
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Old 11-20-2017, 10:50 AM   #19
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How can he write policy that "bans" hunting in another sovereign nation?
Same as a US Citizen to travel to the middle east to join ISIS.

Same as a pervo traveling to Thailand to sleep with minors.

Illegal here but not there but we have laws that will get those types prosecuted.
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Old 11-20-2017, 01:01 PM   #20
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How can he write policy that "bans" hunting in another sovereign nation?
There is a law on the books that prevents US citizens from spending money in Cuba.
As well as those things Sweet Jay posted
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Old 11-20-2017, 01:03 PM   #21
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Trump Sr. has never been too fond of hunting anyway.
His boys hunt but he doesn't "get" it.
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Old 11-20-2017, 03:01 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Landrover View Post
Yes and No! Actually, there was a military takeover (coup) in Zimbabwe earlier this week. The 97 year old President Mugabe was placed under house arrest, along with his 52 year old wife. The situation is very fluid actually. That country (along with Zambia) is at the heart of the elephant import & hunting region. Without understanding of where this is going I understand the "hopefully" temporary halt on imports. Conservation records have shown that the herds are/were stable.........now all bets could be off. Just bad timing honestly!


You are mentioning 2 nations. There are dozens that want and need this lifted to allow selective sport hunting. That's how they generate revenue. If hunting is allowed, they have a monetary reason to manage elephant habitat, which. Winford all species. If not, as in many areas is the countries you mentioned, it will turn into farm land. Only areas that allow hunting stay wild. That's just a fact in this world now.
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Old 11-20-2017, 03:03 PM   #23
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Trump is writing policy to permanently ban elephant hunting altogether.


Post up your proof. Tell us all how trump can ban elephant hunting on 2 continents and dozens of nations.
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Old 11-20-2017, 04:54 PM   #24
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Post up your proof. Tell us all how trump can ban elephant hunting on 2 continents and dozens of nations.
Do you know how to use Google?

Read DJT's on Twitter post from Nov 19 at 5:57pm

It's on Washington Post:

President Trump called elephant hunting a “horror show” Sunday and strongly suggested he will permanently block imports of elephant trophies from two African nations despite his administration’s earlier approval of the practice.

On Sunday, Trump said on Twitter that he would announce a final decision this week. He suggested that he does not buy the argument advanced by pro-hunting advocates within his Interior Department that the imports help protect endangered African elephants.

Trump wrote that he would be “very hard pressed to change my mind that this horror show in any way helps conservation of Elephants or any other animal.”
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Old 11-20-2017, 04:55 PM   #25
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https://mobile.twitter.com/realDonal...7369655808001?
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Old 11-20-2017, 05:00 PM   #26
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For the record (and clarity) DJT is not banning big game hunting abroad, he's just saying you can't bring that prized trophy back to the states to show off.

He is essentially saying you have to "catch and release" that elephant or lion.

Just like the us govt couldn't stop anyone from smoking marry Jane in Amsterdam.
They just prevented you from bringing any back stateside.
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Old 11-20-2017, 05:05 PM   #27
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Do you know how to use Google?



Read DJT's on Twitter post from Nov 19 at 5:57pm



It's on Washington Post:



President Trump called elephant hunting a “horror show” Sunday and strongly suggested he will permanently block imports of elephant trophies from two African nations despite his administration’s earlier approval of the practice.



On Sunday, Trump said on Twitter that he would announce a final decision this week. He suggested that he does not buy the argument advanced by pro-hunting advocates within his Interior Department that the imports help protect endangered African elephants.



Trump wrote that he would be “very hard pressed to change my mind that this horror show in any way helps conservation of Elephants or any other animal.”


I DO know how to use google. If YOU did, you would know that trump, potus of one country, does not have the power to ban elephant hunting, or any other kind of hunting in any other country on this planet. You could also find that even with the ban initiated by the obama run USFWS, elephant hunting continued, because OTHER countries DIDNT ban importation of elephant parts.
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Old 11-20-2017, 06:03 PM   #28
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I DO know how to use google. If YOU did, you would know that trump, potus of one country, does not have the power to ban elephant hunting, or any other kind of hunting in any other country on this planet. You could also find that even with the ban initiated by the obama run USFWS, elephant hunting continued, because OTHER countries DIDNT ban importation of elephant parts.
Go and read my post on CLARITY right above yours and look at the time stamps between mine and yours.

And if you want to be technical there are ways the USA govt can ban you from doing things in certain countries they don't want you doing.

You can't even buy a toothbrush in Cuba without permission from the usa govt.
Try it and see.
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Old 11-20-2017, 06:08 PM   #29
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Just leave it at the usa has ways and means of controlling what us citizens can do abroad

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Old 11-20-2017, 07:44 PM   #30
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You are mentioning 2 nations. There are dozens that want and need this lifted to allow selective sport hunting. That's how they generate revenue. If hunting is allowed, they have a monetary reason to manage elephant habitat, which. Winford all species. If not, as in many areas is the countries you mentioned, it will turn into farm land. Only areas that allow hunting stay wild. That's just a fact in this world now.
That’s the thing with so called conservationists they have no logic.
It’s like the ban on Oryx here in Tx which resulted in almost elimation of them altogether.
No doubt people will starve in Africa as a result of conservation and animals will disappear more due to loss of land - but people here will feel better because they saved an elephant.
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Old 11-20-2017, 08:45 PM   #31
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Go and read my post on CLARITY right above yours and look at the time stamps between mine and yours.



And if you want to be technical there are ways the USA govt can ban you from doing things in certain countries they don't want you doing.



You can't even buy a toothbrush in Cuba without permission from the usa govt.

Try it and see.


I can re read it a dozen times. I commented on this
You responded with a condescending post, which I replied to. This one.
And I'm right. Trump can't ban elephant hunting. You want to discuss ways he can try? Ways to make it difficult to bring them into the US? Sure. But you can twist it all you want, and post more questions about my Google skills. Trump can't ban elephant hunting. It's a revenue generating conservation method in dozens of counties. And they don't have a problem with it. As long as rich people in 100s of other countries want to go and hunt them, they will be if numbers remain stable. They are, and in some areas are being culled by government shooters. More can be made by allowing sport hunting.
As for not being able to buy a toothbrush in Cuba, I'd ask you for proof of that too, because that's a rediculous thing to say,but it's not related at all to this topic.

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Old 11-21-2017, 04:29 AM   #32
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As for not being able to buy a toothbrush in Cuba, I'd ask you for proof of that too, because that's a rediculous thing to say,but it's not related at all to this topic.
It's only kinda related in that it shows how messed up our govt can be and the mechanisms they'll use to control us.

It is called the Trading With The Enemy Act
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trad...my_Act_of_1917

It prevents US citizens from spending one single red cent with any country that is placed on the list.
Two off the top of my head that are on the list are
North Korea
Cuba

Plenty of Canadians go to Cuba on vacations just fine
But U.S. citizens need prior approval from our Dept of Treasury before purchasing the ticket.

Let's get back to hunting.

I have no desire to hunt an elephant.
To be honest I've never killed anything just for the trophy.
Always wanted the meat from blue gill to bass to deer.
I do want a bear rug but I also loved the smoked bear meat my neighbor used to make so there's that

Trump can't ban hunting abroad but who would want to spend $100k on hunting an animal but can't bring the trophy home???
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Old 11-21-2017, 10:44 AM   #33
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It's only kinda related in that it shows how messed up our govt can be and the mechanisms they'll use to control us.



It is called the Trading With The Enemy Act

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trad...my_Act_of_1917



It prevents US citizens from spending one single red cent with any country that is placed on the list.

Two off the top of my head that are on the list are

North Korea

Cuba



Plenty of Canadians go to Cuba on vacations just fine

But U.S. citizens need prior approval from our Dept of Treasury before purchasing the ticket.



Let's get back to hunting.



I have no desire to hunt an elephant.

To be honest I've never killed anything just for the trophy.

Always wanted the meat from blue gill to bass to deer.

I do want a bear rug but I also loved the smoked bear meat my neighbor used to make so there's that



Trump can't ban hunting abroad but who would want to spend $100k on hunting an animal but can't bring the trophy home???


Thank you for that link. Cuba and North Korea...great examples of hunting destinations, but if that's your proof, so be it. But it says with prior approval, I CAN buy that toothbrush in Cuba, doesn't it? And unless trump and CONGRESS places a few dozen African and Asian countries on that "enemies" list, that won't apply anyway.
I'll never elephant hunt. That's not the point. The point is, to keep elephants thriving, they have to have value. Hunting them gives that value. And I too doubt anyone in this country would spend that kind of money and not bring it home. That's why the USFWS listened to these countries and conservation groups to lift this ban.
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Old 11-21-2017, 11:08 AM   #34
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Yes sir........it appears that way. Probably based upon the analogy below akin to horses & dogs. I will say that most American citizens don't even understand bag limits and habitat carrying capacity for deer/geese or even squirrels. We as Americans are sooooo far removed from hunting/fishing that it is NOW an issue in turning that negative tide.

Per your first sentence? Do you have another idea that can be implemented or even added to the current list of tactics? Education is all we have from what I can tell. It starts with our own kids/grandkids. Some on TBH have even said there own kids are against or don't understand hunting. WE all are in trouble if we cant even educate our own offspring/family. Definitely open to any "winning strategy" you or anyone else may have?

WE gotta win this thing in the trenches. With the Trump son's being advid hunters I doubt the administration is caving but the skirmish will get ugly. Here is something we all can help with........if this is truly something other hunters believe in!!! Hopefully the link inside this text below is HOT as it goes straight to our President and Mr. Zinke.

Member Alert
CALL TO ARMS!* SUPPORT*SECRETARY ZINKE & THE FWS DECISION TO IMPORT ELEPHANT TROPHIES FROM ZAMBIA & ZIMBABWE

Use SCI's Action Center to contact President Trump and Secretary of the Interior Zinke now and tell them how much you appreciate the efforts of the Fish & Wildlife Service to remove barriers to sustainable use conservation for African wildlife.*
This week the U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service (FWS) announced that elephants legally hunted in Zimbabwe and Zambia between 2016 and 2018 now can be imported into the United States.* The Service made the announcement at the African Wildlife Consultative Forum, an event co-hosted by the Safari Club International Foundation and the host nation of Tanzania.*
The news from Africa could not have been better for hunters or for anyone who loves or defends hunting culture.* Hunters around the world play an integral role in wildlife conservation and when their rights are restricted, or import bans put in place, wildlife and local African communities all suffer.
This week's FWS announcement is consistent with what conservation scientists and wildlife experts have known for decades—that hunting is beneficial to wildlife and that African range countries know how to manage their elephant populations.
Within hours of the announcement, hysterical anti-hunters and news media outlets went into overdrive, attacking everyone in sight, including the Trump Administration, SCI and even the National Rifle Association of America.* And their efforts seem to have paid off as their shrill, negative reactions has caused President Trump to delay the decision until meeting with Secretary Zinke.
Here's where you can help.* Call or write now and tell President Trump and Secretary Zinke how much you appreciate the efforts of the Fish & Wildlife Service to remove barriers to sustainable use conservation for African wildlife.* Be respectful and tell them you're a proud hunter, that you're not backing down, and that the facts of conservation science are on your side.
Tell them you strongly support the Fish & Wildlife Service's decision to allow the*importation of*elephant trophies from Zambia & Zimbabwe!
Safari Club International - First For Hunters is the leader in protecting the freedom to hunt and in promoting wildlife conservation worldwide. SCI's approximately 200 Chapters represent all 50 of the United States as well as 106 other countries. SCI's proactive leadership in a host of cooperative wildlife conservation, outdoor education and humanitarian programs, with the SCI Foundation and other conservation groups, research institutions and government agencies, empowers sportsmen to be contributing community members and participants in sound wildlife management and conservation. Visit the home page www.SafariClub.org, or call (520) 620-1220 for more information.
International Headquarters Tucson, Arizona · Washington, District of Columbia · Ottawa, Canada
www.SafariClub.org
Mugabe resigns while in detention along with his wife
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Old 11-21-2017, 03:00 PM   #35
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Mugabe resigns while in detention along with his wife
I read that! "Let's see......Do you want to see 98 years old mr. Mugabe......YES.......then resign!!!" He should have been gone 30 years ago. I can only pray it does not turn worse for the people living there.

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Old 11-21-2017, 09:13 PM   #36
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Thank you for that link. Cuba and North Korea...great examples of hunting destinations, but if that's your proof, so be it. But it says with prior approval, I CAN buy that toothbrush in Cuba, doesn't it? And unless trump and CONGRESS places a few dozen African and Asian countries on that "enemies" list, that won't apply anyway.
I'll never elephant hunt. That's not the point. The point is, to keep elephants thriving, they have to have value. Hunting them gives that value. And I too doubt anyone in this country would spend that kind of money and not bring it home. That's why the USFWS listened to these countries and conservation groups to lift this ban.
Ok.
U Win.
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Old 11-22-2017, 08:59 AM   #37
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Ok.
U Win.
You forgot the "I was wrong" part.
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Old 11-22-2017, 09:09 AM   #38
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You forgot the "I was wrong" part.
lol
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Old 11-22-2017, 09:59 AM   #39
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You forgot the "I was wrong" part.
You forgot to turn on your sarcasm meter before you read my post.
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Old 11-22-2017, 10:02 AM   #40
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The US govt bans abortions in African nations.
How can and does it do that?
By restricting foreign aid if the African country doesn't do what the US govt wants (by outlawing abortions).

Trump started this ban up again this year.

Where there's a will...
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Old 11-22-2017, 10:06 AM   #41
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You forgot the "I was wrong" part.


That won't happen. And I don't expect it to happen. I haven't noticed that a lot when posters are proven to be wrong... What I HAVE noticed, is that intelligent people, with obvious google skills, will post something they already know is not completely true, but omit all the info to try and prove THIER point. And on almost every occasion, they get away with it, because no one will point out that intentional omission.
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Old 11-22-2017, 10:22 AM   #42
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That won't happen. And I don't expect it to happen. I haven't noticed that a lot when posters are proven to be wrong... What I HAVE noticed, is that intelligent people, with obvious google skills, will post something they already know is not completely true, but omit all the info to try and prove THIER point. And on almost every occasion, they get away with it, because no one will point out that intentional omission.
What are we debating here?
The us govt never banned hunting in Africa.
It banned bringing home the trophy.
That's why the hunting community has been in an uproar.
Let's stay on topic.

End of the day Trump is keeping an Obama order in tact and that is to ban the importation of foreign big game trophys.

Why the argument?

You still can't bring that lion or elephant you shot in Zim home.

Somewhere we got lost on semantics.
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Old 11-22-2017, 10:45 AM   #43
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What are we debating here?

The us govt never banned hunting in Africa.

It banned bringing home the trophy.

That's why the hunting community has been in an uproar.

Let's stay on topic.



End of the day Trump is keeping an Obama order in tact and that is to ban the importation of foreign big game trophys.



Why the argument?



You still can't bring that lion or elephant you shot in Zim home.



Somewhere we got lost on semantics.


The topic was the ban on elephant parts being discussed. You posted that trump was going to ban elephant hunting. Then you posted that I couldn't go to Cuba and buy a toothbrush. As I just posted, many intelligent people post things to support their position while leaving out the entire truth. If you are intelligent, you know trump can't ban elephant hunting. You also know that if I go to Cuba, I can buy a toothbrush. But you say I can't to support your posting. So either you are deliberately misleading by omission of facts, or you are not as intelligent as I suspected.
Now you are lecturing to stay on topic. That's correct. We should. And just to be clear, I wasn't the one that posted misleading untruths, and got them pointed out.
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Old 11-22-2017, 10:58 AM   #44
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Wow........not sure what I missed, but don't have the brain cells to geaux back and figure it out!

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Old 11-22-2017, 06:22 PM   #45
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How can he write policy that "bans" hunting in another sovereign nation?
probably just banning it in E. Texas.
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