Wolf killed

[Tom]

Wasn’t just talking about wolves being exterminated. Not trolling anything, just trying to educate. And I’m out before any more insults start flying. Should have never gotten involved, can’t educate those that don’t want to be.

I am sure you were not just talking about wolves....Nutria and fire ants lives matter as well.

I apologize for telling you to turn into a canine and run off in the woods....that was not right.

[MountainHunter7]

That’s a big dog!

[sharkhunter]

Someone will be along shortly to say they saw one just like that in East Texas.

Those boys in East Tx need to stop drinking so much.

[JTeLarkin08]

Good lord a bunch of Texas guys, who have never been around wolves, arguing about the effects of wolves.. And we wonder why the B.C. bear hunt got banned so easily. A bunch of hunters cant even agree on shooting a Predator.. SMH

[Texans42]

Thank you! Everybody that wants to kill all wolves should just admit this is the reason.

And the populations would have always been fine if we hadn’t nearly wiped them out to begin with through over hunting,disease, ignorance and habitat loss. Prime example of habitat loss is buffalo. We will never see massive herds of them again. Why? Hunting(slaughtering) to begin with. Now Nowhere to go. I’m just saying it’s not just the wolf’s fault. They need to be cut back to the agreed upon numbers.

We will never see massive buffalo herds again because of fences and buffalo to cattle and cattle to buffalo diseases, not hunting.

The habitat is still there tolerance is not.

[Saltyag15]

Aside from all the butt hurt in this thread...it's a very cool picture! I didn't realize how big those wolves really were.

[Caddo Creek]

Not trying to get into this debate but wanted to share some info.

I’ve hunted the Yellowstone area for Elk twice. I’ve read about the decline of the herd and in 2015 we saw very few Elk.

The ones we saw were those heading over the Mountain when we tried calling and yes we did have Wolf Packs in two(2) different valleys we were hunting.

I believe that the wolves which were introduced were not what was native and they have an impact even if not the largest impact.

I first heard about the trout theory and shift in the bears diet from the native trout to more Elk from a friend in Colorado and my reaction was same as most....riiiigghhttt!!

Then I saw a documentary on TV about how Lake Trout introduction to the Lake or Lakes. The Wildlife people are trying to eradicate them because they have decimated the native trout populations...cutthroat I believe. I believe the cutthroat use the Lakes at certain times of the year or fry and have been fed on by the voracious Lake Trout. Sounds like they are making headway by targeting their spawning areas which took a while for them to figure out.

Also while I was hunting...the amount of beetle kill of the Forrest was incredible....looked like forrest fire but was beetle kill which also affected the pine nuts that bears use for food.

Do I think wolves have had an big effect.....yes!! But I no longer dismiss these other issues as factors as well.

Trout don’t stay in just one lake but at times they may congregate in small areas like a lake....don’t believe me....look at how native tribes netted out a half million acre lake of all walleyes....they netted their spawning areas which are very limited to a few tributaries during their spring spawn.

Those cutthroat may occupy millions of acres in the tributaries during a portion of the year but congregate in lakes etc. during others. Been a while since I watched the documentary on TV so maybe someone else can fill in those facts.

By the way....most of the outfitters believe the Bears are over-populated and need to be managed as well.

The grizzlies up there are plentiful and call it crazy but the guides contend they literally shadow the hunters waiting for an easy meal.

They also told me they rarely see a Moose which was a common occurrence before the reintroduction of the wolves.

I think there are many truths related to this issue and it may a combination of things contributing to the Elk decline in the Yellowstone system.

Hopefully I won’t get pounded as I rarely post....I’m sensitive to getting hammered. [emoji4]

[Mexico]

Sucker is huge!

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

[Pernell]

Read that thread, animals are animals doing their animal things. And again, wolves have not wreaked havoc on the elk population. I suggest everyone do some actual research; because if we’re intending to save the elk then there are a few other things that need to be addressed before wolves. Wolves also aren’t wreaking havoc on livestock or humans.

I guess it is just a coincidence that all the elk started dying after the wolf population exploded. For you to sit there and say that they dont kill a lot of livestock you are really naive. How many head of cattle do you own in Montana? The reports that you read about wolves are written by the people that reintroduced them to the area. If you want the real story talk to the ranchers.

[Pernell]

Nope, I worked for a year on a legislative program in relation to delisting wolves; reviewed the testimonies of thousands of individuals on all sides of the fence, personally interviewed about a hundred more, went over God knows how many studies done by all sides, and finally came to the conclusion that the extermination of wolves was not the best course of action. A regulated harvest of approximately 25% of the wolf population annually is the recommendation that I seconded.

As for Sasha the Wolf, I would never allow her to influence a recommendation that I make to an elected representative of the citizenry. Trust me, it shocked the hell out of a lot of the people I met (great folks on all sides of the argument) that I came down on the pro-hunting side. Yes, I would allow her to influence my opinion of me personally hunting one. Here’s another off the wall opinion of mine, I don’t believe that the breeding of wolf crosses should be legal. Anyways, this discussion is getting way off the original topic and no one is going to change the other person’s mind.

"Sasha the Wolf" and you dont have an agenda? I agree the Green screen has been hijacked!

[breadman]

hummmm , I`m still gonna shot one when and if I ever see one !!!!

[switchbackxt]

So you are saying 99% of the Bears in a 2,219,791 acre area relied on the fish in a 500 acre lake....and it tributaries....

Wow.

What you fail to realize is that Pumalives doesn't have a bear in this race. Only a wolf.

[Justinfitz1]

Awesome pic!

[simek]

I want to thank everyone that has contributed to this thread. It demonstrates just how controversial the wolf issue is, even to folks that, for the most part, spend a very small amount of time in states that actually have wolves.

By reviewing this thread, it’s pretty apparent that the position most folks take on this thread are either dominated by personal interests (I hunt elk, wolves eat elk, wolves are bad….I raise cattle, wolves eat cattle, wolves are bad) or political position (I am conservative, erego the friend of my enemy is my enemy).

One of the most difficult things for people to do (including myself) is to put truly consider the other persons POV. I have hunted out west on numerous occasions, chasing elk. Just because of that, it does not mean that I don’t realize the value wolves bring (aesthetically and economically) to a place like Yellowstone, where people from around the world come to see large predators, like wolves and grizzly bears.

The same Federal government that was largely responsible for sponsoring the large scale removal of wolves from the lower 48 is the same Federal government that is responsible for putting wolves back on the landscape. I have to imagine, at one point, there were probably some discussions that went something like…. “We really f’d up, we need to address this. How do we go about this?”

The reintroduction of a different species of wolf into the lower 48 was probably a no brainer at the time. You can’t bring back a species that is gone (or at least gone past the point of being able to find it using a reasonable amount of resources). With Canadian wolves being so easily accessible, it was probably the path of least resistance. Were there unanticipated negative results or did someone underestimate predation on elk and mule deer….maybe so.

Now, while I don’t personally agree with a good bit of what has been stated on this thread, I will agree that one of the best ways to keep personal opinion out of a situation like this is to base management on good science. If good science drives policy suggests that a population is recovered after meeting a specific number, then that number should be respected. After the number has been met, management goes back to the states and, if deemed legal, hunting season should be established, with $ generated from license sales going back to the states for conservation. One of the reasons the ESA has been hammered is the lack of “sticking to the plan”, which, in fact, is really not an issue with the ESA, it’s an issue with enforcement.

In the end, I personally feel that wolves deserve a spot on the landscape, but need to be managed, and that management should be based on sound, unbiased science, not personal interest or political leaning. Doing that, while easier said than done, can only be successful once people better understand what’s driving the position of those opposing them.

Thanks again for all the good discussion.

[CEO]

I remember hearing Rinella pass along an anecdote about wolf reintroduction on his podcast. I don't remember it exactly but it was along the lines of; the man they got the wolves from to start the reintroduction picked out the meanest, most aggressive wolves he had. Said if we were dumb enough to purposely bring back wolves he would give us the best ones. Not sure on the validity of that but it is interesting.