Look at these graphs & tables!!!

[texansfan]

Show the whole lifestyle and especially the FOOD aspect.

What's a computer?

[Landrover]

The numbers are declining nationally, not just Texas. Thus the LEASE cost discussion is just a microcosm of the overall decline. Sprawl is also another part of the discussion but not the whole discussion, etc, etc. The article is NOT about taking away hunting from anyone. It is about hunting becoming passe', unattractive to kids, natural attrition due to age demographics. Just read some of it and you will get the jist. Some of the potential solutions have real world implications........are we willing to save OUR chosen past time?

I am posting this at my own peril because I may get flamed, but here goes. There seems to be a lot of hypocrisy going on about hunting. I hear on this thread about how the price has gotten too high, trophy hunting is killing hunting, and to many restrictions. Well to me telling me what I have to do (in the interest of improving the herd (antler quality)) is the same is telling what I can't do. I understand general management rules to stop the "it's brown it's down" mentality. How many leases have we seen posted where the cost of the lease is anywhere from $2500 to $4500 plus all the extra money you have to spend to follow the "you have to's" and what is always the prevailing comment...."this shouldn't last long". The market is what anyone is willing to pay and then you aren't sure how long you will have it. Also, we have too many young people that need instant gratification to validate what they do- I drew a blank for the season that just closed but I am not throwing in the towel because I didn't get a physical return on my investment (venison in the freezer)- it is a challenge that I accept to make next year something to look forward to.

I guess I missed what you were gonna get flamed for. There is no completely right answer.........or completely wrong answer.

[texansfan]

The numbers are declining nationally, not just Texas. Thus the LEASE cost discussion is just a microcosm of the overall decline. Sprawl is also another part of the discussion but not the whole discussion, etc, etc. The article is NOT about taking away hunting from anyone. It is about hunting becoming passe',*** unattractive to kids, *** natural attrition due to age demographics. Just read some of it and you will get the jist. Some of the potential solutions have real world implications........are we willing to save OUR chosen past time?
.

What's a computer???

[Man]

Texansfan is throwing bait....someone take it!

[flywise]

I am posting this at my own peril because I may get flamed, but here goes. There seems to be a lot of hypocrisy going on about hunting. I hear on this thread about how the price has gotten too high, trophy hunting is killing hunting, and to many restrictions. Well to me telling me what I have to do (in the interest of improving the herd (antler quality)) is the same is telling what I can't do. I understand general management rules to stop the "it's brown it's down" mentality. How many leases have we seen posted where the cost of the lease is anywhere from $2500 to $4500 plus all the extra money you have to spend to follow the "you have to's" and what is always the prevailing comment...."this shouldn't last long". The market is what anyone is willing to pay and then you aren't sure how long you will have it. Also, we have too many young people that need instant gratification to validate what they do- I drew a blank for the season that just closed but I am not throwing in the towel because I didn't get a physical return on my investment (venison in the freezer)- it is a challenge that I accept to make next year something to look forward to.

I dont know why you would think you would get flamed for this post.
I'll say this, the "what you have to do" and the "what you cant do" typically go hand in hand on nearly all "management minded" leases. Tons of lease ad's posted with long list of what you must provide along with a long list of terms ( permissions) on what you can shoot. I dont see many of these requirements on smaller leases but then again smaller low fence leases will typically have much fewer opportunities at high quality ( scoring ) bucks.
As for instant gratification. I have become more convinced there are just as many adults who have this same mentality in recent years. What other reason would a person pay 15k for a buck. Might just be the first generation to grow up with the everyone gets a trophy crowd.

I think there are most likely many reasons for hunter numbers to be in decline of which antler management is one. It increases prices and places many restrictions. I did not kill a deer this year. I had dozens of bucks and doe inside 10 yds countless times. I hunt a 400ac low fence place in the hill country i have hunted since 1989. I am considered a family member of the land owner and despite only averaging 1 buck every other year in all that time the land owner is increasingly falling into the antler management trap many land owners are falling into and trying to place restrictions on my hunting. He does not hunt, his kids hunt on rare occasions but yet they think a low fence of 400ac could produce 6y/o 150's on a regular basis.It's not going to happen. I finally told them at the beginning of the season that i would not continue to pay if i was going to have to abide by restrictions i dont think are fair. I reminded them that the bucks have gotten much larger on average in the time i have been hunting there precisely because i have already been placing limits on myself. Now, try being a new guy looking for a lease and finding this same place. Talk to a land owner for the first time and he tells you that for 2k you can only shoot a 10 point and a doe. Most people with an average income would walk.

[Landrover]

What's a computer???

...........device, PDA, pad, etc!

[Thumper]

We were told by the x-perts the crossbow and high fence were the salvation of hunting.

[BrandonA]

I have several friends and know others that just gave up on hunting due to the increasing costs and restrictions. You are seeing more and more leases/landowners not allowing kids or allowing them only to come out one weekend. You also have ranches being broken up into small parcels and the new owners not hunting or leasing, especially in the Hillcountry. Its an accumulation of lot of little things that ad up to the big problem.

[Shane]

Huntable acreage is declining. Population is increasing, mostly in urban areas where most people have no connection to nature. The percentage of the population that hunts can't do anything but decline when those things are happening. Hopefully, hunters and conservation organizations will continue to expand their efforts to educate the mostly non-hunter public about wildlife conservation and hunting and how it is vital to the survival of all those cute critters out there in the woods and prairies. Recruiting more new hunters is a piece of the puzzle too, but we'll never be able to see a majority of the population own a hunting license. We need educated non-hunters who support hunting. We need to educate them before the anti-hunters fill them full of lies.

[Shane]

AND...we would do well to stop arguing with and criticizing each other over all the different hunting methods and motivations. There is absolutely nothing wrong with trophy hunting, meat hunting, rifle hunting, crossbow hunting, bow hunting, hunting over bait, hunting over a corn field, hunting in a high fence, hunting on National Forest free range land, or any other kind of hunting. Hunt the way you enjoy and let the other guy/gal do the same, even if they prefer hunting different critters in different places with different methods than you. All we're doing when we criticize each other over that kind of stuff is create the impression that at least some hunting is bad in the minds of all the non-hunters. We need to stop it.

[stykshooter]

What's a computer???

It's a good commercial

[Landrover]

Huntable acreage is declining. Population is increasing, mostly in urban areas where most people have no connection to nature. The percentage of the population that hunts can't do anything but decline when those things are happening. Hopefully, hunters and conservation organizations will continue to expand their efforts to educate the mostly non-hunter public about wildlife conservation and hunting and how it is vital to the survival of all those cute critters out there in the woods and prairies. Recruiting more new hunters is a piece of the puzzle too, but we'll never be able to see a majority of the population own a hunting license. We need educated non-hunters who support hunting. We need to educate them before the anti-hunters fill them full of lies.

.........and that would be the FACT of the MATTER! 5% of Americans hold a hunting license!!! 5%-10% of Americans are ardently against hunting. 85%-90% are fence sitters that don't have a interest either way. They can be swayed either way in years to come......are we willing to send the RIGHT message?

[Landrover]

AND...we would do well to stop arguing with and criticizing each other over all the different hunting methods and motivations. There is absolutely nothing wrong with trophy hunting, meat hunting, rifle hunting, crossbow hunting, bow hunting, hunting over bait, hunting over a corn field, hunting in a high fence, hunting on National Forest free range land, or any other kind of hunting. Hunt the way you enjoy and let the other guy/gal do the same, even if they prefer hunting different critters in different places with different methods than you. All we're doing when we criticize each other over that kind of stuff is create the impression that at least some hunting is bad in the minds of all the non-hunters. We need to stop it.

.....touche'....and those would be the fence sitters (90% non hunters) just looking for a reason to take a stance.... against......or for it!

[texansfan]

Texansfan is throwing bait....someone take it!

...........device, PDA, pad, etc!

Think about it
Hunting is dieing because of our society.
We no longer NEED to hunt for our food.
In my dad's time in the 30s they would go hunt squirrels and rabbits for fun to eat them.
Kids aren't eating that today.
Heck I won't even eat squirrel unless I was forced to.

Vast majority of populstion is being condensed into urban areas where they shun guns and hunting.
NYC
LA
Chicago

It's a generational thing.
How many that were born after 1973 were raised in a hunting household?
How many born after 1993?

When I was growing up I had access to a BB gun since I was double digits.

It's purely a societal shift

Kids don't care about hunting for food or want to deal with the gory details of field dressing a hog.

They want Wright's hickory smoked bacon already shrink wrapped

They want to spend Sunday mornings playing on their iPad in their backyard not freezing their tail off in a blind being extremely silent

We need to shift the priorities of the framework of hunting and fishing in order to save what's left of it

[tradtiger]

As a guy who hunts public land -- with access to a small (25 acre) private tract with its own issues (lack of game) -- I still fork over almost $150 for Super Combo plus Annual Public Hunt permit, plus Duck stamp. Access is definitely an issue, along with severe restrictions on means and qualifying game (antler restrictions, doe only allowed during archery season). Overall, not too bad, but nothing like the access to affordable property and availability of game, growing up hunting with my Dad.

Will say that there was an encouraging point made in the article: if even one third of the active hunters today would recruit a new hunter, the problem would be solved almost immediately. Reckon that's where we at TBH come in.