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-   -   Automobile A/C help (http://discussions.texasbowhunter.com/forums/showthread.php?t=670153)

Diamond S 11-14-2017 08:12 AM

Automobile A/C help
 
So, Sunday the A/C in my truck ( 2015 Chevy diesel ) decided to not work. It was blowing warm air. When the compressor would come on it would sound like some kind of bird, not a belt slipping or bearing going out. I was going to try and put freon in it but the gauge said it was charged. Now the compressor will not come on at all. ( checked all the fuses and they are good ) So I take it to the chevy place ( and I can see the guy who is checking it out ) after about 30 minutes ( only two of them he actually looked at the truck ) I walk over and ask him if he knows the problem. He said not yet and walks away. 20 minutes later he comes back, pokes around for a minute or so closes the hood and writes up his findings as a leaking compressor. He never once put a set of gauges on it. They give me an estimate of $906.38 to replace the compressor.

It may just be me, but if the compressor was leaking, there should be very little to no freon in it right? ( remember my gauge said it was charged )

I am thinking there is a little part somewhere that tells the compressor to kick on and it has went out.

Can anyone tell me where said part may be and/ or if you know anything to check please let me know.

flywise 11-14-2017 08:17 AM

Yes, if it was leaking there would be little to no product in the system.
Their crooks
Get a second opinion

stickerpatch59 11-14-2017 08:17 AM

maybe a low pressure safety switch; they keep the compressor from running if it does get low on Freon, keeps the compressor from burning itself up.

deerplanter 11-14-2017 08:39 AM

The same thing happened to me on my 2014 chevy, it stopped working just before I was leaving the country so I had my wife take it to the dealer while I was gone. They come back and said it was a leaking compressor and it would be 980 to fix it. My wife had them go ahead and when she came back to pick it up a week later she pulled out of the lot and the air stopped working again. She took it back and they looked at it and said they forgot to charge the system. I think that was BS, I now think it was a fuse or something simple. I would take your truck to regular auto shop and see what they say.

Diamond S 11-14-2017 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deerplanter (Post 12924239)
The same thing happened to me on my 2014 chevy, it stopped working just before I was leaving the country so I had my wife take it to the dealer while I was gone. They come back and said it was a leaking compressor and it would be 980 to fix it. My wife had them go ahead and when she came back to pick it up a week later she pulled out of the lot and the air stopped working again. She took it back and they looked at it and said they forgot to charge the system. I think that was BS, I now think it was a fuse or something simple. I would take your truck to regular auto shop and see what they say.

That is the plan. I was just hoping someone on here could tell me what to check and how to check it.

RifleBowPistol 11-14-2017 09:01 AM

When you say your A/C system was charged, what pressures were you seeing? Then was the compressor coming on at all at that point. If the compressor does not come on, it's hard to tell how full the system is.

The noises you are describing, could be a belt slipping due to multiple different problems, it could also be the compressor clutch slipping, again there are multiple reasons that may not be working correctly. If your compressor clutch is slipping, it will typically produce metal shavings and get very hot. Both the heat and the metal shavings are not good for the front seal of the compressor. It's very typical for a clutch hub to slip, produce metal shavings and then shortly afterwards you have a leaking compressor. But the opposite can happen, I have seen compressors leak, then the oil gets on the clutch hub, causing it to slip and burn up the clutch hub.

So how much pressure did the gauge show you had, then was that with the compressor engauged and spinning or with the compressor off?

Diamond S 11-14-2017 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RifleBowPistol (Post 12924296)
When you say your A/C system was charged, what pressures were you seeing? Then was the compressor coming on at all at that point. If the compressor does not come on, it's hard to tell how full the system is.

The noises you are describing, could be a belt slipping due to multiple different problems, it could also be the compressor clutch slipping, again there are multiple reasons that may not be working correctly. If your compressor clutch is slipping, it will typically produce metal shavings and get very hot. Both the heat and the metal shavings are not good for the front seal of the compressor. It's very typical for a clutch hub to slip, produce metal shavings and then shortly afterwards you have a leaking compressor. But the opposite can happen, I have seen compressors leak, then the oil gets on the clutch hub, causing it to slip and burn up the clutch hub.

So how much pressure did the gauge show you had, then was that with the compressor engauged and spinning or with the compressor off?

I was out looking at the truck when you posted this, to answer your questions You sir are on the exact right path. I am about to post what I found and what was fooling me.

Diamond S 11-14-2017 11:20 AM

OK, so here is what I just found out that cleared up a lot of things, as well as appears to have fixed the problem.

I stated the compressor was charged, it was, but I can't tell you the exact PSI because I was using one of the things you buy from Wal-Mart. So I go out fire up the truck turn on the A/C and it" looks" as if the clutch engages, still warm air. So I dig a little deeper and check voltage at the compressor...got it. So now I am thinking bad clutch. I kill the truck and I am going to check the clutch for play and just do a general check to see if anything is obviously wrong. The clutch fell off in my hand!!! The noise I was hearing was the clutch not being tight so when it would try in engage it was slipping. Well the bolt was nowhere to be found, so I scrounged up a bolt that I had to cut off 3 times to make it short enough to not bottom out before it got tight. Got it on and tight and fired up the truck, within 30 seconds I have cold air blowing in my truck. Just think, this certified mechanic missed all of that! Now my concern is 1. did he know the problem and was just trying to make a buck, 2. did he really just miss it? I mean I found it in 5 minutes and I know next to nothing about an A/C and I am far from being a mechanic. 3. Is this a common practice in dealerships?

Thanks to everyone who responded.

DJM 11-14-2017 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diamond S (Post 12924866)
Now my concern is 1. did he know the problem and was just trying to make a buck, 2. did he really just miss it? I mean I found it in 5 minutes and I know next to nothing about an A/C and I am far from being a mechanic. 3. Is this a common practice in dealerships?

Thanks to everyone who responded.

Dealership mechanics work off of commission......................draw your own conclusion from that.

DJ

flywise 11-14-2017 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diamond S (Post 12924866)
OK, so here is what I just found out that cleared up a lot of things, as well as appears to have fixed the problem.

I stated the compressor was charged, it was, but I can't tell you the exact PSI because I was using one of the things you buy from Wal-Mart. So I go out fire up the truck turn on the A/C and it" looks" as if the clutch engages, still warm air. So I dig a little deeper and check voltage at the compressor...got it. So now I am thinking bad clutch. I kill the truck and I am going to check the clutch for play and just do a general check to see if anything is obviously wrong. The clutch fell off in my hand!!! The noise I was hearing was the clutch not being tight so when it would try in engage it was slipping. Well the bolt was nowhere to be found, so I scrounged up a bolt that I had to cut off 3 times to make it short enough to not bottom out before it got tight. Got it on and tight and fired up the truck, within 30 seconds I have cold air blowing in my truck. Just think, this certified mechanic missed all of that! Now my concern is 1. did he know the problem and was just trying to make a buck, 2. did he really just miss it? I mean I found it in 5 minutes and I know next to nothing about an A/C and I am far from being a mechanic. 3. Is this a common practice in dealerships?

Thanks to everyone who responded.

He didn't miss anything.
Dealer told my wife once that the water pump had a leak, the electronic cooling fan was broken and they could do all the repairs for 1300. I told her to bring it home. I drove that car for 130K miles after that visit to the shop before I had to replace the water pump,myself for less than $150 and that $700 fan never got replaced in the 300k miles it had on it

bowhuntertex 11-14-2017 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM (Post 12924979)
Dealership parts changers who have no clue how to actually diagnose a problem on a vehicle work off of commission......................draw your own conclusion from that.

DJ

Fixed it for you ;)b:D;)

miket 11-14-2017 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diamond S (Post 12924866)
OK, so here is what I just found out that cleared up a lot of things, as well as appears to have fixed the problem.

I stated the compressor was charged, it was, but I can't tell you the exact PSI because I was using one of the things you buy from Wal-Mart. So I go out fire up the truck turn on the A/C and it" looks" as if the clutch engages, still warm air. So I dig a little deeper and check voltage at the compressor...got it. So now I am thinking bad clutch. I kill the truck and I am going to check the clutch for play and just do a general check to see if anything is obviously wrong. The clutch fell off in my hand!!! The noise I was hearing was the clutch not being tight so when it would try in engage it was slipping. Well the bolt was nowhere to be found, so I scrounged up a bolt that I had to cut off 3 times to make it short enough to not bottom out before it got tight. Got it on and tight and fired up the truck, within 30 seconds I have cold air blowing in my truck. Just think, this certified mechanic missed all of that! Now my concern is 1. did he know the problem and was just trying to make a buck, 2. did he really just miss it? I mean I found it in 5 minutes and I know next to nothing about an A/C and I am far from being a mechanic. 3. Is this a common practice in dealerships?

Thanks to everyone who responded.

Who really knows, but I have said it here before, and will say it again. A truly skilled craftsman ( mechanic, HVAC, carpenter, machinist etc ) is extremely rare and worth his ( or her ) weight in gold. Most people are just flat out bad at their job.

miket 11-14-2017 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flywise (Post 12925048)
He didn't miss anything.
Dealer told my wife once that the water pump had a leak, the electronic cooling fan was broken and they could do all the repairs for 1300. I told her to bring it home. I drove that car for 130K miles after that visit to the shop before I had to replace the water pump,myself for less than $150 and that $700 fan never got replaced in the 300k miles it had on it

I learned that lesson when I was about 17 y/o. Due to being broke I did all my own maintenance on my truck. One of the things I had to replace was the pitman arm. Some months later I had to replace tie rods. So I did then took it to a place to get it aligned. I watched as the guy went around prying on everything before the alignment ( which irritated me because I didnt ask for a diagnosis, I asked for an alignment ). He comes back in and tells me, of all things, the PITMAN ARM was bad and needed to be replaced! Ticked me off but being young I held my tongue and asked to have it aligned anyway. Had that truck for over 10 more yrs and never had to replace it ( again ) Sorry people!

Diamond S 11-14-2017 04:31 PM

knock on wood, it is still working, I had a real set of gauges put on it and I am sitting at 28 to 30 PSI on the low side. I didn't check the high side. I did inform the dealership that I would not need a new compressor and that it was a 25 cent bolt that their mechanic had failed to notice was missing, so he decided to replace the compressor rather than trouble shoot it. They didn't have much to say about it.

Old Goat1 11-14-2017 06:48 PM

Replace the clutch or at least the clutch bearing Sam. Get a replacement bolt and check the high side pressure. Probably ok if the low side is 28 to 30. Just depends on temp but you want to be sure the compressor and downstream is good.

Diamond S 11-14-2017 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Goat1 (Post 12926287)
Replace the clutch or at least the clutch bearing Sam. Get a replacement bolt and check the high side pressure. Probably ok if the low side is 28 to 30. Just depends on temp but you want to be sure the compressor and downstream is good.

I think it is all good, we will see. I think the bolt fell out either friday or saturday. could have been sooner with the little cool fronts we have had, but Sunday when I went on a trash run is when I noticed the A/C was not working.

RifleBowPistol 11-14-2017 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diamond S (Post 12924866)
OK, so here is what I just found out that cleared up a lot of things, as well as appears to have fixed the problem.

I stated the compressor was charged, it was, but I can't tell you the exact PSI because I was using one of the things you buy from Wal-Mart. So I go out fire up the truck turn on the A/C and it" looks" as if the clutch engages, still warm air. So I dig a little deeper and check voltage at the compressor...got it. So now I am thinking bad clutch. I kill the truck and I am going to check the clutch for play and just do a general check to see if anything is obviously wrong. The clutch fell off in my hand!!! The noise I was hearing was the clutch not being tight so when it would try in engage it was slipping. Well the bolt was nowhere to be found, so I scrounged up a bolt that I had to cut off 3 times to make it short enough to not bottom out before it got tight. Got it on and tight and fired up the truck, within 30 seconds I have cold air blowing in my truck. Just think, this certified mechanic missed all of that! Now my concern is 1. did he know the problem and was just trying to make a buck, 2. did he really just miss it? I mean I found it in 5 minutes and I know next to nothing about an A/C and I am far from being a mechanic. 3. Is this a common practice in dealerships?

Thanks to everyone who responded.

Something else to check, make sure you have around a .020" to .030" air gap between the A/C clutch hub and the pulley. There is typically a small shim up inside the clutch hub. It spaces the clutch hub out. It spaces off of the end of the compressor shaft. The bolt that was missing, goes through the center of that shim. The shim, will look like a thin washer, they are typically about .020" thick. You won't be able to see it, unless you pull the clutch hub off and look up in the bore where the splines are. Down at the bottom of the hub bore, is where the shim will be. No need to pull the hub off and check the shim, if the clutch air gap is good, but if the air gap is too tight, it can drag and eat up the clutch hub and the mating face of the pulley. Then you will need a new clutch hub/pulley, if they sell them separately, some times the do, some they don't. Some compressors you have to buy a complete assembly, those will be the expensive one. If the air gap is too big, the compressor will not engage, or will engage intermittently. That is probably what you had going on. With no bolt holding the compressor clutch hub, where it should be, it probably walked or vibrated forward, increasing the clutch air gap. If the air gap is too great, the electromagnetic clutch coil can not pull the hub back to engage the compressor.

Efren 11-14-2017 09:46 PM

If you still have coverage, take it to another mechanic who is certified. Your warranty will still cover the reapirs

doublearrow 11-14-2017 09:51 PM

Where you out of a mileage warranty?

Diamond S 11-15-2017 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doublearrow (Post 12926885)
Where you out of a mileage warranty?

Yep by about 6K. I thought they may have some kind of service bulletin on it, and was hoping that buying 8 vehicles from them in the past 16 years that they would take care of it for me, I guess not.

Diamond S 11-15-2017 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RifleBowPistol (Post 12926823)
Something else to check, make sure you have around a .020" to .030" air gap between the A/C clutch hub and the pulley. There is typically a small shim up inside the clutch hub. It spaces the clutch hub out. It spaces off of the end of the compressor shaft. The bolt that was missing, goes through the center of that shim. The shim, will look like a thin washer, they are typically about .020" thick. You won't be able to see it, unless you pull the clutch hub off and look up in the bore where the splines are. Down at the bottom of the hub bore, is where the shim will be. No need to pull the hub off and check the shim, if the clutch air gap is good, but if the air gap is too tight, it can drag and eat up the clutch hub and the mating face of the pulley. Then you will need a new clutch hub/pulley, if they sell them separately, some times the do, some they don't. Some compressors you have to buy a complete assembly, those will be the expensive one. If the air gap is too big, the compressor will not engage, or will engage intermittently. That is probably what you had going on. With no bolt holding the compressor clutch hub, where it should be, it probably walked or vibrated forward, increasing the clutch air gap. If the air gap is too great, the electromagnetic clutch coil can not pull the hub back to engage the compressor.

Yes sir, I found it when the clutch came off and put it back where and how I found it. If it will all stay together for 10 months, it will be traded off and hopefully I will not be putting as many miles on the new truck and can keep the new one covered a bit longer.

doublearrow 11-15-2017 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diamond S (Post 12927564)
Yep by about 6K. I thought they may have some kind of service bulletin on it, and was hoping that buying 8 vehicles from them in the past 16 years that they would take care of it for me, I guess not.

That sucks man.

Dieselman 11-15-2017 09:32 PM

Iíve got a neighbor that asked me why his AC would cool or get cold running down the road. Then when he stopped it would get hot. Guessing due to on phone and not at the truck. Fan no air flow told him holler when you want to look at. About 2 weeks later get a text asking about compressor, clutch etc. AC clutch got hot knocked seal out of compressor. The repair shop wanted 1300.00 to fix. Told him go parts store and get the stuff and fix in drive way. I sent him a pic of compressor, dryer , expansion valve. etc. Parts store cost of 300/400 buck. He said repair shop was telling him he needed compressor, clutch , dryer etc. They told him that clutch came separately. Told him AC gauges, vac pump sitting here. Holler when heís ready. Also found the fan out on the condenser causing the issue to begin with.


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